From Mathieu.Malaterre@creatis.insa-lyon.fr Tue Jun 03 09:44:28 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 09:44:28 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19N6T6-0003yC-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 09:44:28 +0200 Received: from pop.univ-lyon1.fr (pop.univ-lyon1.fr [134.214.100.7]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h537iNoU021058 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 09:44:24 +0200 Received: from pop (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pop.univ-lyon1.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 978FA10B74D for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 09:43:22 +0200 (CEST) Received: from creatis.insa-lyon.fr (creatismathieu.univ-lyon1.fr [194.167.219.13]) by pop.univ-lyon1.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id E462410BBA2 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 09:43:18 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EDC5031.5010608@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 09:37:21 +0200 From: Mathieu Malaterre User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4b) Gecko/20030507 X-Accept-Language: fr, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: arnouten@bzzt.net Subject: First shot doxygen-xml References: <3EDB999B.7020708@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> <20030602225034.GC11112@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> In-Reply-To: <20030602225034.GC11112@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-32.2 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 1217 Lines: 40 Arnout, Sorry, but I am not sure I understand what you meant, could you further detail the difference between API and internal ? BTW there is a \internal command: http://www.stack.nl/~dimitri/doxygen/commands.html#cmdinternal is it what you were speaking about ? Thanks for giving more details, mathieu Arnout Engelen wrote: > On Mon, Jun 02, 2003 at 08:38:19PM +0200, Mathieu Malaterre wrote: > >>Hi all, >> >> I have discussed with Vadim about the documentation of wxWindows. >> There has been some good proposals/links in the mailing-list I didn't know >>about. Anyway I'll add my stuff too. > > > A while ago I tried to summarize some of the mailingist's discussion > on the wiki: > > http://wiki.wxwindows.org/wiki.pl?Using_Doxygen_For_The_WxWindows_Documentation > > Maybe you could add your points there, too. Or something. > > The main 'con' I found was that I think we'd need extra flags in the > documentation to distinguish between 'public' functions (i.e., that are > part of the API and thus should be in the end-user documentation) and > the 'internal' functions (i.e., functions that are used internally and > might change in future versions of wx). > > > Regards, > > Arnout > > From Mathieu.Malaterre@creatis.insa-lyon.fr Fri Jun 06 10:39:31 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 10:39:31 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OCl1-0007VA-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 10:39:31 +0200 Received: from pop.univ-lyon1.fr (pop.univ-lyon1.fr [134.214.100.7]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h568dMLs030567 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 10:39:25 +0200 Received: from pop (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pop.univ-lyon1.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE51210A9EB for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 10:33:39 +0200 (CEST) Received: from creatis.insa-lyon.fr (creatismathieu.univ-lyon1.fr [194.167.219.13]) by pop.univ-lyon1.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id A973A10C3D9 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 10:29:40 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EE04F76.9040006@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 10:23:18 +0200 From: Mathieu Malaterre User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4b) Gecko/20030507 X-Accept-Language: fr, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Arnout Engelen Subject: Re: First shot doxygen-xml [WAS: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)] References: <3EDB999B.7020708@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> <3EDC5318.6050509@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> <20030606081817.GN18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> In-Reply-To: <20030606081817.GN18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-32.2 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Status: RO Content-Length: 3084 Lines: 97 Arnout, If you want the script: you can have it here: http://www.creatis.insa-lyon.fr/~malaterre/Doxygen/temp.py I think I needn't tell you that it was written on a sunday evening (it is awfull to read). I have spend allmost of my week at the mechanic (car troubles during french burden is sooooo pleasant !), so I haven't had a chance to modify it. I hope things will go better now, so I might actually improve it (use functions with real names, and maybe doxygened it ;) Feel free to read it...but I warned you it uses the python 're' module !! mathieu Ps: I don't know awk , I don't like perl, that's why I choose python ! Ps2: to use it go to wxWindow/docs/latex/wx $ python temp.py button.dox it should create then a file button.mat that is a -almost- a merge of button.h and button.dox....good luck IMPORTANT: please don't mention it in the wiki until it is actually readable/usable, thanks ! Arnout Engelen wrote: > On Tue, Jun 03, 2003 at 09:49:44AM +0200, Mathieu Malaterre wrote: > >>>Sorry, I don't really understand what does this mean? Isn't the whole idea >>>of using doxygen that it can parse the sources directly? Or do you mean >>>that we're going to keep the current docs and just post-process them with >>>doxygen? >>> >>>I'm a bit lost by now. I was thinking about using doxygen as C++ parser >>>(i.e. C++ -> XML translator) and I don't quite understand how do you >>>propose to use it? >> >>Exactly, but for now you have header file in include/wx/* and doc in >>docs/latex/wx. So my script read, let say, 'button.tex', open 'button.h' >>and add comments on top of each associated method. Thus this script is >>meant to be run only once. I don't think someone is willing to do it by >>hand -if someone is willing, please contact me ;)- >> >>Then the header files contains the documentation of each method, doxygen >>can now process them (in xml/html/rtf/man/whatever). The whole thing for >>now is to merge doc and src. > > > Is this a hypothetical script or something you actually wrote? if the > second, might I take a look at it, maybe even put it online and > reference it on the wikipage? > > > Regards, > > Arnout > > >>>This looks good (as your previous examples did) but there are some strange >>>things, e.g. wxFrame and wxControl don't derive from wxWindow in the class >>>hierarchy tree for some reason. >> >>Looking at include/wx/* and include/wx/gtk/* here are the options: >> >>class wxFrame : public wxFrameBase >>and >>class WXDLLEXPORT wxFrameBase : public wxTopLevelWindow >>and: >>class wxControl : public wxControlBase >> >>I might actually work on the MSW branch, this would solve the problem I >>had with wxWindowGTK... >> >>regards, >>mathieu >> >> >>--------------------------------------------------------------------- >>To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org >>For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org > > -- Mathieu Malaterre CREATIS 28 Avenue du Doyen LEPINE B.P. Lyon-Montchat 69394 Lyon Cedex 03 http://www.creatis.insa-lyon.fr/~malaterre/ From Mathieu.Malaterre@creatis.insa-lyon.fr Fri Jun 06 11:06:57 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 11:06:57 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19ODBZ-0007ey-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 11:06:57 +0200 Received: from pop.univ-lyon1.fr (pop.univ-lyon1.fr [134.214.100.7]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5696qLs000801 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 11:06:53 +0200 Received: from pop (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pop.univ-lyon1.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E4C410C653 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 10:57:32 +0200 (CEST) Received: from creatis.insa-lyon.fr (creatismathieu.univ-lyon1.fr [194.167.219.13]) by pop.univ-lyon1.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC57410C2BD for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 10:41:56 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EE0524C.50505@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 10:35:24 +0200 From: Mathieu Malaterre User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4b) Gecko/20030507 X-Accept-Language: fr, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Arnout Engelen Subject: Re: First shot doxygen-xml : update References: <3EDB999B.7020708@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> <3EDC5318.6050509@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> <20030606081817.GN18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> In-Reply-To: <20030606081817.GN18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-15.7 required=5.5 tests=IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Status: RO Content-Length: 136 Lines: 5 I have discovered the python script were not the very last I wrote. please update your browser and try again (temp.py) thanks mathieu From john.a.gooch@xo.com Tue May 27 18:23:29 2003 >From arnouten Tue May 27 18:23:29 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnoutwiki@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 27 May 2003 18:23:29 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19KhEX-0006xN-00 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 18:23:29 +0200 Received: from triton.xo.com (plasmlprd03.pla.dc.xo.com [205.158.160.113]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4RGNNVg031557 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 18:23:25 +0200 Received: from ilchicsimr002.mail.inthosts.net ([172.19.22.42]) by triton.xo.com (Switch-3.0.4/Switch-3.0.0) with ESMTP id h4RGJceF008409 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 11:19:50 -0500 (CDT) Received: from ILCHICVEXC006 ([172.19.22.21]) by ilchicsimr002.mail.inthosts.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Tue, 27 May 2003 12:19:37 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C3246B.C457BDEE" Subject: MSVC Setup for wxWindows Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 12:19:37 -0400 Message-ID: <74D43BE60F22AC44A7F33AD0D88B69210210796D@ILCHICVEXC006.mail.inthosts.net> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: MSVC Setup for wxWindows Thread-Index: AcMka3YjbtZbSYy0Rh2iUVryveNL/w== From: "Gooch, John A" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 May 2003 16:19:37.0138 (UTC) FILETIME=[C4624120:01C3246B] X-SAASFSig: 0883762c7bcc822940b33af9b2f58abd X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.6 required=5.5 tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_FONT_COLOR_BLUE,HTML_MESSAGE version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 3566 Lines: 93 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3246B.C457BDEE Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello, small note that you may want to include somewhere in the document. When I reached step 3 of these instructions, http://wiki.wxwindows.org/wiki.pl?MSVC_Setup_Guide , I was stuck due to MS VC++ demanding that I login to Visual Source Safe ( which I did not install ) before it would let me open the project. I searched through the "installed programs" and checked for VSS in the main listing and also in the list of VC++ components. Still no dice. So I found the VSS folder here -> C:\Program Files\Microsoft Visual Studio\Common\VSS , close VC++, deleted that folder, and then I could open the wxWindows workspace file with no problems. I just did this a few minutes ago, but I don't think it will cause me any problems. I will let you know if I find out otherwise. Btw, I am fortezza on the wxWindows mailing list. Your guide is awesome so far, just what the wxWin noob needs to get started. Oh, and I am definitely a noob. :) John A. Gooch=20 NT LAN Administrator, Denver Market Phone: 303-539-1232 Mobile: 303-419-2014 Fax: 720-284-6002 "We now return you to your regularly scheduled program." ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3246B.C457BDEE Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MSVC Setup for wxWindows

Hello, small note that you may want to = include somewhere in the document. When I reached step 3 of these = instructions, http://wiki.wxwindows.org/wiki.pl?MSVC_Setup_Guide<= /U> , I was stuck due to MS VC++ = demanding that I login to Visual Source Safe ( which I did not install ) = before it would let me open the project. I searched through the = "installed programs" and checked for VSS in the main listing = and also in the list of VC++ components. Still no  dice. So I found = the VSS folder here -> C:\Program Files\Microsoft Visual = Studio\Common\VSS , close VC++, deleted that folder, and then I could = open the wxWindows workspace file with no problems. I just did this a = few minutes ago, but I don’t think it will cause me any = problems.

I will let you know if I find out = otherwise. Btw, I am fortezza on the wxWindows mailing list. Your guide = is awesome so far, just what the wxWin noob needs to get started. Oh, = and I am definitely a noob. :)



John A. Gooch
NT LAN Administrator, Denver = Market
Phone: 303-539-1232
Mobile: 303-419-2014
Fax: 720-284-6002
"We now return you to your regularly scheduled = program."

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3246B.C457BDEE-- From gm@virtuasites.com.br Mon May 26 16:56:16 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 26 May 2003 16:56:16 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19KJOa-0001ow-00 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:56:16 +0200 Received: from kicarros.com.br (200-171-57-51.speedyterra.com.br [200.171.57.51] (may be forged)) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4QEu81k003515 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:56:11 +0200 Received: from gm (cm-net-fln-C8B08CA8.brdterra.com.br [200.176.140.168]) by kicarros.com.br (8.11.6/8.8.7) with ESMTP id h4QFuwU18427; Mon, 26 May 2003 12:56:59 -0300 Message-ID: <001501c32398$53bfdd70$0100a8c0@gm> From: "Graciliano M. P. \(Virtua Sites\)" To: Cc: "Arnout Engelen" References: <000001c32341$69ee7ef0$8d47fea9@GUNTHER> <001601c32348$ec463f30$a88cb0c8@gm> <20030526091450.GA16739@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Subject: Re: ANNOUNCE: XML reference of wxWindows classes. Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 12:06:00 -0300 Organization: Virtua Sites MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.5 required=5.5 tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 1373 Lines: 37 > > Is it online somewhere? where do I find it? :) Will be on CPAN soon. I need to check it first... > looks very nice. I didn't like the current xml parser in cpan at all, > this looks a lot more like what i'd find useful :). Thanks. ;) > Though references in perl tend to look ugly imho :|. Can be ugly (for you), but they are much powerfull. Note that the syntax for XML::Smart is not really Perl reference. Is all fake! Yes, the module use the Perl syntax to work with the XML tree, but what happens inside is much different. I have used some resources to catch the Perl syntax "query", and paste it through a TIEd Hash and Array. > > Note, this is only the first version of the XML reference. I will appreciate > > if some one check the files, or any type of feedback.... > > I was thinking... if this output turns out to be 'perfect', as it > were... maybe we could consider using this xml format as basis instead > of the current latex stuff that might scare some people off... might be > worth investigating. Well, for docs I preffer to convert to POD! ;-P The XML reference is there to make some automatic tool to write wxWindows code (in the many different ways: wxPerl, wx4J, or just C/C++). Or for an editor. Let's say that you want to see the arguments of a class. The editor can show it automatically just when you are writing the code. Regards, GMP. From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 02:57:36 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 02:57:36 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OoV6-0001sb-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 02:57:36 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h580vWw0017212 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 02:57:32 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h580vWgS018476 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 02:57:32 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h580vWpo018475 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 02:57:32 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h580vVgS018465 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 02:57:31 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 1683 invoked by uid 43863); 8 Jun 2003 00:57:16 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 1672 invoked from network); 8 Jun 2003 00:57:16 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 20:57:09 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Subject: Documentation plan of action From: David Elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 4665 Lines: 90 There's been (again) a lot of spiraling discussion about the documentation system. I was going to reply to Arnout's message that he's got a preliminary Doxygen system working, but I felt it better to create a new discussion thread. Apparently a lot of people have gotten this idea that I among others absolutely hate the idea of using Doxygen. Nothing could be further from the truth. The only thing I absolutely hate is actually putting the reference documentation into the source code. I'll admit it's a personal preference, but I certainly can't be the only one here who actually likes clear and concise source code without a lot of extra fluff. And surely I'm not the only one who likes to use 80x25 VIM windows. It really irks me that many of those pushing to place the documentation into the source code dismiss the argument that it clutters the source. Unless you are using large editor windows, it will quickly become a major pain to glance through a header file. That is something I don't feel I should have to give up. I have yet to hear a really convincing argument as to why the reference documentation should be in the header files. I certainly have heard and understood all of the arguments put forward. Not one has convinced me that it's a good idea. Please note, that's not an invitation to make another one as there's a very good chance I've already heard it. In fact, I'd say the probability of hearing a new argument is really close to zero. Arnout, I really appreciate your work with Doxygen. There's a lot of very useful material there and the format is very nice for what it is: straight reference documentation. I can see this as being a very useful resource in addition to the current documentation which I believe to be a near perfect marriage of a manual with reference documentation. So here's the plan: Use Doxygen to do what Arnout already has it doing and pull the descriptions from the manual instead of the source. This gives us the best of both worlds. We keep the existing documentation that flows very nicely from a manual to reference documentation and we add very advanced reference documentation. I realize this gives up the supposed advantage of having the descriptions in the source code, but having looked at Doxygen documentation for other projects I always believed that Doxygen is very useful. Now having seen with my own eyes Doxygen applied to wxWindows I can certainly say it's very useful even without having the documentation inside the source code. Will it be easy to do? No, but none of this is going to be easy to do. Even to use Doxygen itself someone is going to have to write a script to pull the documentation from the tex files and put it into the source code. What I'm saying is that if you have to write that anyway, why not instead write it to pull the documentation from the tex and hand it over to Doxygen? However, I also realize that Tex is not really ideal for parsing. Not only for computers, but also for humans. Therefore, I might suggest that we do go ahead and convert the existing manual into a more manageable format such as XML. I feel that both of those taken together should solve the real problems. As far as I can tell, the real problems are that few people are willing to write in Tex (a shame, but I can't change this) and that the separate documentation is not very well linked to the source. Sadly, I believe I've made this exact argument and if I remember correctly it was decided long ago that something resembling this solution would be ideal. In fact, I'm certainly not the first to put forward something like this. The problem is that the Doxygen purists seem to get their knickers in a twist at the mere thought of using Doxygen without having the documentation in the source code. Perhaps this time around we have some people willing to listen and more importantly willing to compromise? We don't lose anything at all with this solution, and we gain a lot. Going to a pure Doxygen system we will lose functionality. Most importantly we would lose the excellent manual+reference that we already have and that I and many others enjoy so much. To me, that is 100% unacceptable which is why I am so adamant against it. In the mean time, I believe the current documentation system will do just fine until someone is willing, able, and has enough time to implement this plan. -Dave --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 04:12:53 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 04:12:53 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Opfu-00021Q-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 04:12:53 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h582Ckw0018148 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 04:12:46 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h582CkgS020797 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 04:12:46 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h582CkVG020796 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 04:12:46 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h582CjgS020786 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 04:12:46 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 14722 invoked by uid 43863); 8 Jun 2003 02:12:33 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 14715 invoked from network); 8 Jun 2003 02:12:32 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action From: Charles Tilbury To: wxWindows In-Reply-To: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> References: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Message-Id: <1055038346.1578.25.camel@crunchy.attbi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.2 (1.2.2-4) Date: 07 Jun 2003 19:12:26 -0700 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.0 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1839 Lines: 45 Bravo! I too use a 80 column text editor. I like for things to be simple. I believe that content in the source code, which is foramtted in a way that is not easy to read, is akin to designing a file format that depends on using a tab character instead of a space character. Never (repeat, never) a good idea, even in an accepted standard, such as make files. What I feel is a better use of time is to create more tutorial information. I have read most of the example programs, and I feel that I understand most of it. I would like to see the information in them pulled together in a tutorial format. (maybe I will do that my self, I don't know). The main reasons that I decided to use wxWindows for my commercial project is the documentation and the completeness of the libraries. The documentation is (IMHO) nearly perfect in that it is complete and accurate, It is also easy to access the specific information that I am using. For my purposes, the kind of (documentation) change that has been discussed in the previous thread will not increase the value of wxWindows. In fact it will decrease it's value to me. My focus is on using the libraries, not modifying them. I need to be able to find out what is going on in a hurry. Now you have my $0.0002 USD worth! Great work guys! Charles Tilbury Portland, OR. On Sat, 2003-06-07 at 17:57, David Elliott wrote: > There's been (again) a lot of spiraling discussion about the > documentation system. I was going to reply to Arnout's message that > he's got a preliminary Doxygen system working, but I felt it better to > create a new discussion thread. <<<>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 06:35:44 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 06:35:44 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OruC-0002Ss-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 06:35:44 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h584ZeFK022247 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 06:35:40 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h584VtgS024896 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 06:31:55 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h584VtSp024895 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 06:31:55 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h584VsgS024884 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 06:31:54 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 2613 invoked by uid 43863); 8 Jun 2003 04:31:41 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 2606 invoked from network); 8 Jun 2003 04:31:41 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EE2BC24.5090105@treyarch.com> Date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 21:31:32 -0700 From: Wade Brainerd User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030313 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action References: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> In-Reply-To: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.0 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 744 Lines: 18 Sounds like a good plan. Let the users who really want Doxygen have it, but keep the 'silent majority' happy too. Anyway, I just wanted to weigh in on the whole difficulty of writing TeX issue. I had never seen or used TeX before wxWindows, but have had no problem documenting any of my patches. I just looked at what was already there and added to it. I can't see how anyone would have difficulty understanding the syntax, it's not like it's Forth or something ;) IMO it's more concise and easier to read than XML, even. Wade --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 08:07:10 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 08:07:10 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OtKg-000326-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 08:07:10 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h58676FK023486 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 08:07:06 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5863LgS027662 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 08:03:21 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5863L8x027661 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 08:03:21 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5863KgS027651 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 08:03:21 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 21204 invoked by uid 43863); 8 Jun 2003 06:03:04 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 21148 invoked from network); 8 Jun 2003 06:03:03 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 23:01:11 -0700 Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Kevin Ollivier To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> Message-Id: <9B18C130-9976-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,HTML_00_10,HTML_MESSAGE,IN_REP_TO, KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 6745 Lines: 126 On Saturday, June 7, 2003, at 05:57 PM, David Elliott wrote: > There's been (again) a lot of spiraling discussion about the > documentation system. I was going to reply to Arnout's message that > he's got a preliminary Doxygen system working, but I felt it better to > create a new discussion thread. > > Apparently a lot of people have gotten this idea that I among others > absolutely hate the idea of using Doxygen. Nothing could be further > from the truth. The only thing I absolutely hate is actually putting > the reference documentation into the source code. I'll admit it's a > personal preference, but I certainly can't be the only one here who > actually likes clear and concise source code without a lot of extra > fluff. And surely I'm not the only one who likes to use 80x25 VIM > windows. It really irks me that many of those pushing to place the > documentation into the source code dismiss the argument that it > clutters the source. Unless you are using large editor windows, it > will quickly become a major pain to glance through a header file. > > That is something I don't feel I should have to give up. I have yet > to hear a really convincing argument as to why the reference > documentation should be in the header files. I certainly have heard > and understood all of the arguments put forward. Not one has > convinced me that it's a good idea. Please note, that's not an > invitation to make another one as there's a very good chance I've > already heard it. In fact, I'd say the probability of hearing a new > argument is really close to zero. > > Arnout, I really appreciate your work with Doxygen. There's a lot of > very useful material there and the format is very nice for what it is: > straight reference documentation. I can see this as being a very > useful resource in addition to the current documentation which I > believe to be a near perfect marriage of a manual with reference > documentation. > > So here's the plan: Use Doxygen to do what Arnout already has it doing > and pull the descriptions from the manual instead of the source. > > This gives us the best of both worlds. We keep the existing > documentation that flows very nicely from a manual to reference > documentation and we add very advanced reference documentation. > > I realize this gives up the supposed advantage of having the > descriptions in the source code, but having looked at Doxygen > documentation for other projects I always believed that Doxygen is > very useful. Now having seen with my own eyes Doxygen applied to > wxWindows I can certainly say it's very useful even without having the > documentation inside the source code. I agree with your points here, especially that Doxygen can play a role without having to replace the current documentation system. I think the current documentation lends itself well to beginners, while the Doxygen output is more helpful for advanced users and internal development. Thinking about how it could fit into the wxWindows documentation/web site, I think having it replace the "wxWindows Class Heirarchy" listed on the docs page would be the most fitting. It could even be used 'as is' for the time being, without pulling descriptions from the docs. It is certainly an upgrade from the text output that is currently there! > Will it be easy to do? No, but none of this is going to be easy to > do. Even to use Doxygen itself someone is going to have to write a > script to pull the documentation from the tex files and put it into > the source code. What I'm saying is that if you have to write that > anyway, why not instead write it to pull the documentation from the > tex and hand it over to Doxygen? > > However, I also realize that Tex is not really ideal for parsing. Not > only for computers, but also for humans. Therefore, I might suggest > that we do go ahead and convert the existing manual into a more > manageable format such as XML. > > I feel that both of those taken together should solve the real > problems. As far as I can tell, the real problems are that few people > are willing to write in Tex (a shame, but I can't change this) and > that the separate documentation is not very well linked to the source. Well, I think the real problem with TeX is that most people are unable to put in the necessary time to update the converters. ^_- TeX syntax actually is not that bad, but XML is IMHO a better compromise between the needs of the documentation writer (easy to write but flexible syntax) and the software developer (easy to parse, consistently follows formatting rules). BTW, after some research I haven't yet been able to find a LaTeX-> conversion tool that I've gotten to work with the wxWindows tex files. The only tool I've found that has parsed the wxWindows TeX files properly is pyLaTeX which doesn't convert to DocBoo, but this is actually a useful tool because it parses LaTeX into Python objects and includes a pretty full-featured HTML conversion tool. (In other words, it does most of the hard stuff for us.) Writing a DocBook converter would be a bit tedious but definitely doable. It basically would require changing the tag names from HTML to the corresponding DocBook tags (i.e.
    becomes and so forth), and writing a few new source files for macros like wxheading, etc. Probably a day or two of work. Now it's just a matter of finding time to do it... ;-) > Sadly, I believe I've made this exact argument and if I remember > correctly it was decided long ago that something resembling this > solution would be ideal. In fact, I'm certainly not the first to put > forward something like this. > > The problem is that the Doxygen purists seem to get their knickers in > a twist at the mere thought of using Doxygen without having the > documentation in the source code. Perhaps this time around we have > some people willing to listen and more importantly willing to > compromise? > > We don't lose anything at all with this solution, and we gain a lot. > Going to a pure Doxygen system we will lose functionality. Most > importantly we would lose the excellent manual+reference that we > already have and that I and many others enjoy so much. To me, that is > 100% unacceptable which is why I am so adamant against it. > > In the mean time, I believe the current documentation system will do > just fine until someone is willing, able, and has enough time to > implement this plan. 'Nuff said! Kevin --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 11:09:14 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 11:09:14 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OwAs-0003JB-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 11:09:14 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5899AFK027152 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 11:09:10 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5895PgS004198 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 11:05:25 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5895Pdf004197 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 11:05:25 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5895OgS004187 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 11:05:24 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 24075 invoked by uid 43863); 8 Jun 2003 09:05:11 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 24068 invoked from network); 8 Jun 2003 09:05:10 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 21:04:50 +1200 Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v482) From: Andrew Bush To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In-Reply-To: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> Message-Id: <42A66924-9990-11D7-AAD3-000393411DC8@xtra.co.nz> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.482) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.5 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 5792 Lines: 159 bravo, totally agree on all points. > There's been (again) a lot of spiraling discussion about the=20 > documentation system. I was going to reply to Arnout's message that = he's=20 > got a preliminary Doxygen system working, but I felt it better to = create=20 > a new discussion thread. > > Apparently a lot of people have gotten this idea that I among others=20= > absolutely hate the idea of using Doxygen. Nothing could be further = from=20 > the truth. The only thing I absolutely hate is actually putting the=20= > reference documentation into the source code. I'll admit it's a = personal=20 > preference, but I certainly can't be the only one here who actually = likes=20 > clear and concise source code without a lot of extra fluff. And = surely I' > m not the only one who likes to use 80x25 VIM windows. It really irks = me=20 > that many of those pushing to place the documentation into the source=20= > code dismiss the argument that it clutters the source. Unless you are=20= > using large editor windows, it will quickly become a major pain to = glance=20 > through a header file. > > That is something I don't feel I should have to give up. I have yet = to=20 > hear a really convincing argument as to why the reference = documentation=20 > should be in the header files. I certainly have heard and understood = all=20 > of the arguments put forward. Not one has convinced me that it's a = good=20 > idea. Please note, that's not an invitation to make another one as = there' > s a very good chance I've already heard it. In fact, I'd say the=20 > probability of hearing a new argument is really close to zero. > > Arnout, I really appreciate your work with Doxygen. There's a lot of=20= > very useful material there and the format is very nice for what it is:=20= > straight reference documentation. I can see this as being a very = useful=20 > resource in addition to the current documentation which I believe to = be a=20 > near perfect marriage of a manual with reference documentation. > > So here's the plan: Use Doxygen to do what Arnout already has it doing=20= > and pull the descriptions from the manual instead of the source. > > This gives us the best of both worlds. We keep the existing=20 > documentation that flows very nicely from a manual to reference=20 > documentation and we add very advanced reference documentation. > > I realize this gives up the supposed advantage of having the = descriptions=20 > in the source code, but having looked at Doxygen documentation for = other=20 > projects I always believed that Doxygen is very useful. Now having = seen=20 > with my own eyes Doxygen applied to wxWindows I can certainly say it's=20= > very useful even without having the documentation inside the source = code. > > Will it be easy to do? No, but none of this is going to be easy to = do. =20 > Even to use Doxygen itself someone is going to have to write a script = to=20 > pull the documentation from the tex files and put it into the source = code. > What I'm saying is that if you have to write that anyway, why not=20 > instead write it to pull the documentation from the tex and hand it = over=20 > to Doxygen? > > However, I also realize that Tex is not really ideal for parsing. Not=20= > only for computers, but also for humans. Therefore, I might suggest = that=20 > we do go ahead and convert the existing manual into a more manageable=20= > format such as XML. > > I feel that both of those taken together should solve the real = problems. =20 > As far as I can tell, the real problems are that few people are = willing=20 > to write in Tex (a shame, but I can't change this) and that the = separate=20 > documentation is not very well linked to the source. > > Sadly, I believe I've made this exact argument and if I remember=20 > correctly it was decided long ago that something resembling this = solution=20 > would be ideal. In fact, I'm certainly not the first to put forward=20= > something like this. > > The problem is that the Doxygen purists seem to get their knickers in = a=20 > twist at the mere thought of using Doxygen without having the=20 > documentation in the source code. Perhaps this time around we have = some=20 > people willing to listen and more importantly willing to compromise? > > We don't lose anything at all with this solution, and we gain a lot. =20= > Going to a pure Doxygen system we will lose functionality. Most=20 > importantly we would lose the excellent manual+reference that we = already=20 > have and that I and many others enjoy so much. To me, that is 100%=20 > unacceptable which is why I am so adamant against it. > > In the mean time, I believe the current documentation system will do = just=20 > fine until someone is willing, able, and has enough time to implement=20= > this plan. > > -Dave > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org > For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org > > "I'm talking to all of you, here!" continued God, His voice rising to a=20= shout. "Do you hear Me? I don't want you to kill anybody. I'm against = it,=20 across the board. How many times do I have to say it? Don't kill each=20 other any more, ever! I'm fucking serious!" =A0 Upon completing His outburst, God fell silent, standing quietly at the=20= podium for several moments. Then, witnesses reported, God's shoulders=20 began to shake, and He wept. (Quote from = http://www.theonion.com/onion3734/god_clarifies_dont_kill.html) --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 12:24:20 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 12:24:20 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OxLY-0003YF-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 12:24:20 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h58AOFFK028365 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:24:15 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h58AOFgS011402 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:24:15 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h58AOFmv011400 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:24:15 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h58AOEgS011390 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:24:14 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 8520 invoked by uid 43863); 8 Jun 2003 10:24:02 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 8513 invoked from network); 8 Jun 2003 10:24:01 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 11:31:41 +0200 From: Arnout Engelen To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Message-ID: <20030608093141.GG3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> References: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Face: +5<4p=wAw9CfJeb1)}#72dL9Kz#0|wnyTLORn(~.;+B3?(:8HXkA^9yzF/aHD/p~Ge]GlYyLtI3+U<""hFLN3JH}}n= X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.9 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 4749 Lines: 108 Hi, Thanks for the nice wrap-up. I think there has been very useful discussion, and this adds some much-needed focus. On Sat, Jun 07, 2003 at 08:57:09PM -0400, David Elliott wrote: > absolutely hate the idea of using Doxygen. Nothing could be further > The only thing I absolutely hate is actually putting the reference > documentation into the source code. ok, I personally disagree, but i'm absolutely willing to give that up. > Arnout, I really appreciate your work with Doxygen. There's a lot of > very useful material there and the format is very nice for what it is: > straight reference documentation. Thanks. (it also still needs a *lot* of non-trivial work, though, and it remains to be seen if we can get this to output the way we want it. Time will Tell :)) > So here's the plan: Use Doxygen to do what Arnout already has it doing > and pull the descriptions from the manual instead of the source. > > Will it be easy to do? No, but none of this is going to be easy to > do. *nod*! > However, I also realize that Tex is not really ideal for parsing. Not > only for computers, but also for humans. Therefore, I might suggest > that we do go ahead and convert the existing manual into a more > manageable format such as XML. Much agreed. The problem I have with the current Tex docs is that they're not 'structured'. What I mean by that is that allthough they do describe the markup at a 'high level' (i.e., in a format that might be converted to html or whatnot), the semantics of the content is lost. I think it'd be much to be preferred to write documentation like: A button is a control that contains a text string, and is one of the commonest elements of a GUI. It may be placed on a dialog box or panel, or indeed almost any other window. Left-justifies the label. Aligns the label to the top of the button. Right-justifies the bitmap label. Aligns the label to the bottom of the button. Creates the button as small as possible instead of making it of the standard size (which is the default behaviour ). etcetera. This way it would be still straightforward to generate the current docs, but since we also know what each line *means*, we could automatically process it, extract only the descriptions, etc etc etc. > The problem is that the Doxygen purists seem to get their knickers in a > twist at the mere thought of using Doxygen without having the > documentation in the source code. Perhaps this time around we have > some people willing to listen and more importantly willing to > compromise? (in fact, doxygen does have a feature that allows you to write docs seperately from the classes themselves, see http://www.stack.nl/~dimitri/doxygen/docblocks.html, chapter 'Documentation at other places'. I wouldn't prefer that, though.) Based on the discussion, I'd like to put forward a general idea about the way this might be done: * documentation is written in some high-level language like xml, see above * we use some existing tool, (doxygen??), to generate high-level information about the source code (might be xml). This would be information like: - there is a class wxButton - it inherits from: ... - it has public methods: ... - etcetera * we write a script to make wxwindows-specific changes to this, such as removing _wxHashTable, merging wxCaretBase and wxCaret, etc. * we write a script to merge these two into one. Information about the structure of the code ('this class inherits from...') is taken from the data generated from source, other information, obviously, from the docs that were manually written. This tool could complain if a certain function is declared but not documented, for example, and require us to either document it or ignore it explicitly. Might either produce documentation directly or (an) xml file(s) which could be xlst'd into documentation in various formats. > In the mean time, I believe the current documentation system will do > just fine until someone is willing, able, and has enough time to > implement this plan. True, of course. Thanks for reading this far, i'm very interested in hearing what people think of this approach. Arnout --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 15:08:29 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 15:08:29 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OzuP-0003tD-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 15:08:29 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h58D8OFK030923 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 15:08:25 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h58D8OgS024788 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 15:08:24 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h58D8OB6024787 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 15:08:24 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h58D8NgS024777 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 15:08:24 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 6257 invoked by uid 43863); 8 Jun 2003 13:08:09 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 6249 invoked by uid 509); 8 Jun 2003 13:08:09 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Sun Jun 08 13:08:09 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!news.eunet.no!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!ppp-8-140.29-151.libero.IT!not-for-mail From: Giuseppe Bilotta Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 15:04:19 +0200 Organization: Bilotta Message-ID: References: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> <20030608093141.GG3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-8-140.29-151.libero.it (151.29.140.8) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1055077461 14692132 151.29.140.8 (16 [156467]) X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.60 Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25693 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 2109 Lines: 81 Arnout Engelen wrote: > Much agreed. The problem I have with the current Te[X] docs is that > they're not 'structured'. What I mean by that is that allthough they do > describe the markup at a 'high level' (i.e., in a format that might be > converted to html or whatnot), the semantics of the content is lost. > > I think it'd be much to be preferred to write documentation like: > > > A button is a control that contains a text string, and is > one of the commonest elements of a GUI. It may be placed on a dialog box > or panel, or indeed almost any other window. > > Left-justifies the label. > Aligns the label to the > top of the button. > Right-justifies the > bitmap label. > Aligns the label to > the bottom of the button. > Creates the button > as small as possible instead of making it of the standard size (which is > the default behaviour ). > > > etcetera. This way it would be still straightforward to generate the > current docs, but since we also know what each line *means*, we could > automatically process it, extract only the descriptions, etc etc etc. As I mentioned, the problem is with the specific current status of the doc, and not "intrinsic" to the use of (La)TeX as a documentation format. For example in a properly structured LaTeX class the above would become \begin{class}{wxButton} \begin{description} A button is etcoetera \end{description} \begin{parameters} \parameter[wxBU_LEFT][WIN32] does this and that \parameter[WXBU_TOP][WIN32] does this and that .. \parameter[wxBU_EXACTFIT] Creates the button etcoetera \end{parameters} \end{class} (or in ConTeXT, another TeX format: \startclass{wxButton} \startdescription (as always) \stopdescription \startparameters \parameter[name=wxBU_LEFT,platform=WIN32] From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 16:06:00 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 16:06:00 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19P0o4-00041k-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 16:06:00 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h58E5tFK031891 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 16:05:56 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h58E2AgS028377 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 16:02:10 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h58E2ABx028376 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 16:02:10 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h58E29gS028366 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 16:02:10 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 29815 invoked by uid 43863); 8 Jun 2003 14:01:55 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 29808 invoked from network); 8 Jun 2003 14:01:55 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 16:00:49 +0200 From: Arnout Engelen To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Message-ID: <20030608140049.GJ3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> References: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> <20030608093141.GG3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Face: +5<4p=wAw9CfJeb1)}#72dL9Kz#0|wnyTLORn(~.;+B3?(:8HXkA^9yzF/aHD/p~Ge]GlYyLtI3+U<""hFLN3JH}}n= X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.9 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1104 Lines: 29 On Sun, Jun 08, 2003 at 03:04:19PM +0200, Giuseppe Bilotta wrote: > > Arnout Engelen wrote: > > Much agreed. The problem I have with the current Te[X] docs is that > > they're not 'structured'. What I mean by that is that allthough they do > > describe the markup at a 'high level' (i.e., in a format that might be > > converted to html or whatnot), the semantics of the content is lost. > > As I mentioned, the problem is with the specific current status of > the doc, and not "intrinsic" to the use of (La)TeX as a documentation > format. Agreed. First and foremost we want a structured way to express the docs. Exactly what format should be used: I used XML as an example, but the TeX-based formalism you put forward looks suitable, too. XML has the advantage of being well-known, so people will recognise it and there are parser libs available for most languages. Kind regards, Arnout --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon Jun 09 14:07:10 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 09 Jun 2003 14:07:10 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19PLQc-0000gF-00 for ; Mon, 09 Jun 2003 14:07:10 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h59C76kk004108 for ; Mon, 9 Jun 2003 14:07:07 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h59C3LNQ000730 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 14:03:21 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h59C3Lt7000729 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 14:03:21 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h59C3KNQ000717 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 14:03:20 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 20344 invoked by uid 43863); 9 Jun 2003 12:02:55 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 20337 invoked by uid 509); 9 Jun 2003 12:02:55 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Mon Jun 09 12:02:54 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!feed.news.nacamar.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!194.168.222.22.MISMATCH!newspeer1-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail From: "William Manley" Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows References: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> <20030608093141.GG3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2003 12:59:06 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.2.179.21 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net 1055159927 80.2.179.21 (Mon, 09 Jun 2003 12:58:47 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2003 12:58:47 BST Organization: ntl Cablemodem News Service Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25723 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.3 required=5.0 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,PRIORITY_NO_NAME,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCES version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2358 Lines: 56 > (in fact, doxygen does have a feature that allows you to write docs > seperately from the classes themselves, see > http://www.stack.nl/~dimitri/doxygen/docblocks.html, chapter > 'Documentation at other places'. I wouldn't prefer that, though.) Wouldn't it be much easier to just generate one of those "documentation in other places" files from the source and then let doxygen do the rest? > Based on the discussion, I'd like to put forward a general idea > about the way this might be done: > > * documentation is written in some high-level language like xml, > see above * This documentation is converted into a doxygen type file with all the event table etc information just put in the class description all nice and formatted > * we use some existing tool, (doxygen??), to generate high-level information > about the source code (might be xml). This would be information like: > - there is a class wxButton > - it inherits from: ... > - it has public methods: ... > - etcetera * Just get it to create the html/pdf/whatever docs instead > * we write a script to make wxwindows-specific changes to this, such > as removing _wxHashTable, merging wxCaretBase and wxCaret, etc. Not required (Done above) > * we write a script to merge these two into one. Information about the > structure of the code ('this class inherits from...') is taken from > the data generated from source, other information, obviously, from > the docs that were manually written. > This tool could complain if a certain function is declared but not > documented, for example, and require us to either document it or > ignore it explicitly. > Might either produce documentation directly or (an) xml file(s) which > could be xlst'd into documentation in various formats. Not required (Doxygen merges it inherently) > > In the mean time, I believe the current documentation system will do > > just fine until someone is willing, able, and has enough time to > > implement this plan. > > True, of course. Thanks for reading this far, i'm very interested in > hearing what people think of this approach. What do you think? William Manley --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 12:20:00 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 12:20:00 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OxHM-0003Wy-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 12:20:00 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h58AJtFK028248 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:19:56 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h58AGBgS010886 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:16:11 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h58AGAco010885 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:16:10 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h58AG9gS010859 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:16:10 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 6156 invoked by uid 43863); 8 Jun 2003 10:15:55 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 6149 invoked from network); 8 Jun 2003 10:15:54 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) From: Vaclav Slavik To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 11:42:57 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.2 References: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> In-Reply-To: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1; boundary="Boundary-02=_mUw4+nBKlCYLtfe"; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <200306081143.02501.vaclav.slavik@matfyz.cz> X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.0 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, PGP_SIGNATURE_2,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_KMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1056 Lines: 35 --Boundary-02=_mUw4+nBKlCYLtfe Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Description: signed data Content-Disposition: inline David Elliott wrote: > However, I also realize that Tex is not really ideal for parsing. > Not only for computers, but also for humans. In fact I find LaTeX _much_ easier to parse by humans than XML formats=20 such as DocBook -- based on my experience with editing both of then=20 in VIM. It's probably easier to modify exiting (simple)LaTeX document=20 than DocBook one if you don't know the language, too -- there's much=20 less syntax noice in LaTeX. VS =2D-=20 PGP key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=3Dget&search=3D0x465264C9 --Boundary-02=_mUw4+nBKlCYLtfe Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.2 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQA+4wUmxDYa/UZSZMkRApbuAKCkNB3J72Ps4ur7QD7XyG2fjnvYpgCgmc+9 9GM1MuzWxR3LnnGqXBKK9P4= =Bc8E -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Boundary-02=_mUw4+nBKlCYLtfe-- From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 12:35:32 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 12:35:32 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OxWO-0003aA-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 12:35:32 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h58AZRFK028569 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:35:28 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h58AZRgS011994 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:35:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h58AZRXf011993 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:35:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h58AZQgS011983 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:35:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 10774 invoked by uid 43863); 8 Jun 2003 10:35:11 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 10766 invoked from network); 8 Jun 2003 10:35:11 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) From: "Lukasz Michalski" To: Subject: RE: Documentation plan of action Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 12:37:12 +0200 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.0 required=5.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 786 Lines: 20 > clutters the source. Unless you are using large editor windows, it > will quickly become a major pain to glance through a header file. > Just to mention another possibility: Yes, I don't like doing it to. So I put @brief, @param[s], @return in *.h only, and detailed description in *.cpp file. This way I have clear, consise and very informative header files. Having all ref docs in header file makes class declaration very very long which is uncomfortable for developer. And if you work with IDE that has class browser you can find detailed description easy. Regards, Lukasz --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon Jun 09 19:40:29 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 09 Jun 2003 19:40:29 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19PQdB-0001QP-00 for ; Mon, 09 Jun 2003 19:40:29 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h59HePkk009147 for ; Mon, 9 Jun 2003 19:40:25 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h59HaeNQ005971 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 19:36:40 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h59HaecL005970 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 19:36:40 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h59HadNQ005957 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 19:36:39 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 26826 invoked by uid 43863); 9 Jun 2003 17:36:24 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 26819 invoked from network); 9 Jun 2003 17:36:24 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EE4C5AB.90602@xs4all.nl> Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2003 19:36:43 +0200 From: Klaas Holwerda User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.0 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1420 Lines: 45 Lukasz Michalski wrote: >>clutters the source. Unless you are using large editor windows, it >>will quickly become a major pain to glance through a header file. >> >> >> > >Just to mention another possibility: > >Yes, I don't like doing it to. So I put @brief, @param[s], @return in *.h >only, and detailed description in *.cpp file. This way I have clear, consise >and very informative header files. Having all ref docs in header file makes >class declaration very very long which is uncomfortable for developer. And >if you work with IDE that has class browser you can find detaile > Right!, what is wrong with this approach. And all other documentation ( like tutorial stuff and topics etc in Docbook), As can be seen from the next link it is very easy to have docbook link directly into the Doxygen HTML. I just use a role attribute on the classname tag, and a small customization XSLT added to the docbook stylesheets does the rest, http://wxart2d.sourceforge.net/docs/docbook_html/ch01s02.html But now that we know VIM can just "close" the documentation lines to a single line .. ;-)) , what is the argument for not putting it in there? Or is even not seeing it already a problem ;-) Klaas --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon Jun 09 19:53:11 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 09 Jun 2003 19:53:11 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19PQpT-0001SD-00 for ; Mon, 09 Jun 2003 19:53:11 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h59Hr7kk009373 for ; Mon, 9 Jun 2003 19:53:07 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h59Hr7NQ007870 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 19:53:07 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h59Hr7YM007869 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 19:53:07 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h59Hr6NQ007857 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 19:53:06 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 2801 invoked by uid 43863); 9 Jun 2003 17:52:50 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 2794 invoked from network); 9 Jun 2003 17:52:50 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2003 13:52:28 -0400 Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: David Elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3EE4C5AB.90602@xs4all.nl> Message-Id: <230175BD-9AA3-11D7-A8B4-0003938C5A62@stcnet.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1292 Lines: 34 On Monday, June 9, 2003, at 01:36 PM, Klaas Holwerda wrote: > But now that we know VIM can just > > "close" the documentation lines to a single line .. > > ;-)) , what is the argument for not putting it in there? > Or is even not seeing it already a problem ;-) That is just one argument of many against putting the documentation into the source. The biggest argument against it, IMHO, is the fact that we'd lose the excellent manual we already have. Since Doxygen does apparently have support for pulling documentation from Docbook I'm failing to understand why wxWindows should undergo the radical change of moving the documentation into the source. Given Doxygen's abilities it would seem ideal to write a script to convert the TeX into Docbook for feeding into Doxygen. Such a script would be useful for the documentation in its current state. Furthermore, if we decided to move to Docbook at a later time, we'd already have the means to do it. One step at a time, folks! So, does anybody care to write this script, or are we going to "discuss" this further? -Dave --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon Jun 09 20:07:24 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 09 Jun 2003 20:07:24 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19PR3E-0001WG-00 for ; Mon, 09 Jun 2003 20:07:24 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h59I7Kkk009786 for ; Mon, 9 Jun 2003 20:07:20 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h59I7KNQ009442 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 20:07:20 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h59I7JcV009441 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 20:07:19 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h59I7JNQ009429 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 20:07:19 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 8958 invoked by uid 43863); 9 Jun 2003 18:07:02 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 8951 invoked from network); 9 Jun 2003 18:07:02 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EE4CCD9.5020401@xs4all.nl> Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2003 20:07:21 +0200 From: Klaas Holwerda User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action References: <230175BD-9AA3-11D7-A8B4-0003938C5A62@stcnet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1558 Lines: 44 David Elliott wrote: > > That is just one argument of many against putting the documentation > into the source. The biggest argument against it, IMHO, is the fact > that we'd lose the excellent manual we already have. Why? Convert it to docbook and the reference to the doxygen class docs links nicely with it. > Since Doxygen does apparently have support for pulling documentation > from Docbook I'm failing to understand why wxWindows should undergo > the radical change of moving the documentation into the source. Well the main argument is making things simpler (for non tex fans) and more likely to be complete and up to data. I did not know one can have doxygen use Docbook somehow? But it is easy to link Docbook with doxygen HTML. Maybe even convert doxygen XML to Docbook if needed. > Given Doxygen's abilities it would seem ideal to write a script to > convert the TeX into Docbook for feeding into Doxygen. How, or did i not follow this thread properly? > Such a script would be useful for the documentation in its current > state. Furthermore, if we decided to move to Docbook at a later time, > we'd already have the means to do it. I was thinking about this many times but ... This would be good to have indeed, but although i know enough about Docbook and XML, the wxWindows Tex thing is to much for me, Klaas --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon Jun 09 20:25:55 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 09 Jun 2003 20:25:55 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19PRL9-0001Xt-00 for ; Mon, 09 Jun 2003 20:25:55 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h59IPpkk010027 for ; Mon, 9 Jun 2003 20:25:51 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h59IM6NQ011012 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 20:22:06 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h59IM6AE011011 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 20:22:06 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h59IM5NQ010998 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 9 Jun 2003 20:22:05 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 12361 invoked by uid 43863); 9 Jun 2003 18:21:48 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 12354 invoked from network); 9 Jun 2003 18:21:48 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2003 14:20:53 -0400 Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: David Elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3EE4CCD9.5020401@xs4all.nl> Message-Id: <1ADA78F2-9AA7-11D7-A8B4-0003938C5A62@stcnet.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.8 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2100 Lines: 58 On Monday, June 9, 2003, at 02:07 PM, Klaas Holwerda wrote: > > David Elliott wrote: > >> >> That is just one argument of many against putting the documentation >> into the source. The biggest argument against it, IMHO, is the fact >> that we'd lose the excellent manual we already have. > > Why? Convert it to docbook and the reference to the doxygen class docs > links nicely with it. > Not quite the same as what we have. I prefer to take small steps toward the larger goal of better documentation. In fact, I think it's pretty obvious that the only way any change is going to happen is if we take it in baby steps. >> Since Doxygen does apparently have support for pulling documentation >> from Docbook I'm failing to understand why wxWindows should undergo >> the radical change of moving the documentation into the source. > > Well the main argument is making things simpler (for non tex fans) and > more likely to be complete and up to data. > I did not know one can have doxygen use Docbook somehow? > I thought someone mentioned it could, but I guess he meant the following: > But it is easy to link Docbook with doxygen HTML. Maybe even convert > doxygen XML to > Docbook if needed. > >> Given Doxygen's abilities it would seem ideal to write a script to >> convert the TeX into Docbook for feeding into Doxygen. > > How, or did i not follow this thread properly? > Perhaps I didn't follow it properly. >> Such a script would be useful for the documentation in its current >> state. Furthermore, if we decided to move to Docbook at a later >> time, we'd already have the means to do it. > > I was thinking about this many times but ... > This would be good to have indeed, but although i know enough about > Docbook and XML, the wxWindows > Tex thing is to much for me, > Well, someone has mentioned pyLaTeX lately. Perhaps it would help considerably. -Dave --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Wed Jun 11 17:48:17 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 17:48:17 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Q7pg-0005yb-00 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 17:48:17 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5BFmCYb010434 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 17:48:12 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5BFmCNQ010983 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 17:48:12 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5BFmBFH010982 (8.12.9/1.3); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 17:48:11 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5BFmANQ010970 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 17:48:11 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 15100 invoked by uid 43863); 11 Jun 2003 15:47:52 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 15093 invoked from network); 11 Jun 2003 15:47:51 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 08:45:50 -0700 Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Kevin Ollivier To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <230175BD-9AA3-11D7-A8B4-0003938C5A62@stcnet.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 4195 Lines: 88 On Monday, June 9, 2003, at 10:52 AM, David Elliott wrote: > On Monday, June 9, 2003, at 01:36 PM, Klaas Holwerda wrote: > >> But now that we know VIM can just >> >> "close" the documentation lines to a single line .. >> >> ;-)) , what is the argument for not putting it in there? >> Or is even not seeing it already a problem ;-) > > That is just one argument of many against putting the documentation > into the source. The biggest argument against it, IMHO, is the fact > that we'd lose the excellent manual we already have. > > Since Doxygen does apparently have support for pulling documentation > from Docbook I'm failing to understand why wxWindows should undergo > the radical change of moving the documentation into the source. Are you sure about this? I know folks have suggested implementing such a feature during this discussion, but I don't think it is already implemented in Doxygen. Doxygen supports XML, but I don't think that it supports DocBook specifically. (It uses it's own XML dialect to output class info.) I think it is true though that many fail to see the kinds of documentation logic and formatting logic that would end up in the source as the result of such a conversion. wxPython/wxPerl/wxBasic-specific notes? What about examples? What happens when we want to expand these 'notes' into port specific documentation? Should we add these into the source as well, or instead make each port maintain its own (largely redundant) documentation? I honestly wonder if some of the people contributing to the discussion have even read the notes that were placed on the wiki (http://wiki.wxwindows.org/wiki.pl?Documentation_System) because the Doxygen system does not meet the last two items, and I haven't heard much discussion as to how it could. It's just been a largely redundant back and forth about how documentation in source is good (or bad), but it is not a universally 'good' or 'bad' thing. Documentation in the source is bad *if* it does not meet all the documentation needs you have, and 'good' if it does meet those needs. So hopefully we can focus on what wxWindows' documentation system needs and how to meet all those needs, not on what Doxygen needs to become wxWindows' documentation system. In any case, I think the main appeal of Doxygen (based on my own observations and the comments of others) lies not in its uses as a documentation tool per se, but it's ability to parse and graph out large source code trees. It does do an excellent job of visually outlining the structure and inheritance of classes, and creating 'source browser' hierarchies. This feature is mainly of benefit to advanced users/developers who are interested in the internal structure of wxWindows, and as such, I really think it's best suited to replace the current 'wxWindows Class Heirarchy' document. > Given Doxygen's abilities it would seem ideal to write a script to > convert the TeX into Docbook for feeding into Doxygen. Such a script > would be useful for the documentation in its current state. > Furthermore, if we decided to move to Docbook at a later time, we'd > already have the means to do it. TeX->Doxygen would probably be easier, given that Doxygen really uses a TeX-like format itself. But Doxygen seems geared towards technical documentation and not development of a manual. It can be used to do this, but that's not its primary focus, and as such, this functionality would probably have to be 'extended' to get it to do this. But if we're having troubles extending tex2rtf... =) > One step at a time, folks! > > So, does anybody care to write this script, or are we going to > "discuss" this further? Amen! =) I plan on eventually using pyLaTeX to create a TeX->DocBook converter if no one else steps up to the plate, but it probably won't be for another couple months. =( (Unless I get ahead of things on wxMozilla or get so much caffine in me that I can't sleep one night...!) Thanks, Kevin --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Wed Jun 11 19:01:31 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 19:01:31 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Q8yY-0006Ac-00 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 19:01:31 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5BH1QYb011786 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 19:01:26 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5BH1QNQ022986 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 19:01:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5BH1QDc022985 (8.12.9/1.3); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 19:01:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5BH1ONQ022971 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 19:01:25 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 6175 invoked by uid 43863); 11 Jun 2003 17:01:05 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 6168 invoked from network); 11 Jun 2003 17:01:05 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:59:48 -0400 Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: David Elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <1C60D9BA-9C2E-11D7-9E25-0003938C5A62@stcnet.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2851 Lines: 63 On Wednesday, June 11, 2003, at 11:45 AM, Kevin Ollivier wrote: > > On Monday, June 9, 2003, at 10:52 AM, David Elliott wrote: > >> >> That is just one argument of many against putting the documentation >> into the source. The biggest argument against it, IMHO, is the fact >> that we'd lose the excellent manual we already have. >> >> Since Doxygen does apparently have support for pulling documentation >> from Docbook I'm failing to understand why wxWindows should undergo >> the radical change of moving the documentation into the source. > [snip] > In any case, I think the main appeal of Doxygen (based on my own > observations and the comments of others) lies not in its uses as a > documentation tool per se, but it's ability to parse and graph out > large source code trees. It does do an excellent job of visually > outlining the structure and inheritance of classes, and creating > 'source browser' hierarchies. This feature is mainly of benefit to > advanced users/developers who are interested in the internal structure > of wxWindows, and as such, I really think it's best suited to replace > the current 'wxWindows Class Heirarchy' document. > Right ... >> Given Doxygen's abilities it would seem ideal to write a script to >> convert the TeX into Docbook for feeding into Doxygen. Such a script >> would be useful for the documentation in its current state. >> Furthermore, if we decided to move to Docbook at a later time, we'd >> already have the means to do it. > > TeX->Doxygen would probably be easier, given that Doxygen really uses > a TeX-like format itself. But Doxygen seems geared towards technical > documentation and not development of a manual. It can be used to do > this, but that's not its primary focus, and as such, this > functionality would probably have to be 'extended' to get it to do > this. But if we're having troubles extending tex2rtf... =) > Well, that is the plan. To KEEP the existing documentation (or something very close to it) and ADD Doxygen (somehow pulling descriptions form the existing docs) for its class browsing and other advanced abilities. >> One step at a time, folks! >> >> So, does anybody care to write this script, or are we going to >> "discuss" this further? > > Amen! =) I plan on eventually using pyLaTeX to create a TeX->DocBook > converter if no one else steps up to the plate, but it probably won't > be for another couple months. =( (Unless I get ahead of things on > wxMozilla or get so much caffine in me that I can't sleep one > night...!) > Well, I think the problem is everyone has other things they'd rather be working on. -Dave --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Wed Jun 11 22:36:53 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 22:36:53 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19QCKz-0006d9-00 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 22:36:53 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5BKamYb015186 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 22:36:49 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5BKX4NQ026487 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 22:33:04 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5BKX4A4026486 (8.12.9/1.3); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 22:33:04 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5BKX2NQ026472 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 22:33:03 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 9661 invoked by uid 43863); 11 Jun 2003 20:32:44 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 9654 invoked from network); 11 Jun 2003 20:32:44 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EE7920D.10406@xs4all.nl> Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 22:33:17 +0200 From: Klaas Holwerda User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 3813 Lines: 99 Kevin Ollivier wrote: > > > I think it is true though that many fail to see the kinds of > documentation logic and formatting logic that would end up in the > source as the result of such a conversion. > wxPython/wxPerl/wxBasic-specific notes? What about examples? What > happens when we want to expand these 'notes' into port specific > documentation? Should we add these into the source as well, or instead > make each port maintain its own (largely redundant) documentation? I > honestly wonder if some of the people contributing to the discussion > have even read the notes that were placed on the wiki > (http://wiki.wxwindows.org/wiki.pl?Documentation_System) because the > Doxygen system does not meet the last two items, and I haven't heard > much discussion as to how it could. Oke i see your point ( after reading ;-) ) Some ideas. So how about writing our own DTD ( or just define somehow a set of XML tags ), which contains everything we see fit for making documentation. I once created a simple SGML format CXXDOC that contained general class documentation in SGML. On the next few links you will find it, all template stuff was based on templates for "perceps". http://www.xs4all.nl/~kholwerd/tmp/cxxdoc.dtd http://www.xs4all.nl/~kholwerd/texper/readme.html At was used/can be used on top of the docbook DTD, so all the general editing stuff which you find in documents is still possible. e.g When a class or member description is complicated or large , one can use normal docbook tags to write as far as complete books ;-) to document it. But the key is, that such a system would contains only structured information on the top. So the Notes on wxPython/Perl etc, could be defined in an extra tag etc. And again inside such a tag one can write whatever is needed with docbook tags. -the current class documentation can be converted to the "wxWindows Class Doc XML" But where possible we need special tags to define wxWindows specific documentation. e.g. , etc. and also and whatever is needed. -we can create from "wxWindows Class Doc XML" the other format we need ( Docbook Html Tex etc.) This is not so complicated since most of the difficult work is already in the Docbook stylesheets. We just add something extra for the XML tags we use in "wxWindows Class Doc XML". I have experience with this part myself. -we can link directly into the doxygen stuff is we want to, like i did with my docbook of wxart2D. But that is not a must, actually every other output format can have is own needs. Now Doxygen comes in: - using the docygen XML output format we can compare the "wxWindows Class Doc XML" and create warning where the two differ in information like parameters etc etc. This is of course done using XSLT to convert to some intermediate format in order to easily diff the two. -we can transform the doxygen XML into the "wxWindows Class Doc XML" using XSLT, this is ideal for new classes to generate the first documentation in "wxWindows Class Doc XML". After that all the notes etc can be added. The above does not mean that one needs to add documentation to the *.h or *.cpp files. Still it is possible, since a check can be made to compare the Doxygen XML and the "wxWindows Class Doc XML". For people writing contribs or there own stuff, or for some reason prefer to write all docs into the Cpp/h files, the above seems to be a good comprimize. The can use the system as an extra to the doxygen outputs. Would this solve most problems? Klaas --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Thu Jun 12 00:07:09 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 00:07:09 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19QDkK-0006rI-00 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 00:07:09 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5BM71Yb016729 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 00:07:04 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5BM71NQ008530 (8.12.9/3.58); Thu, 12 Jun 2003 00:07:01 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5BM71pF008529 (8.12.9/1.3); Thu, 12 Jun 2003 00:07:01 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5BM70NQ008515 (8.12.9/3.58); Thu, 12 Jun 2003 00:07:00 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 9817 invoked by uid 43863); 11 Jun 2003 22:06:41 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 9810 invoked from network); 11 Jun 2003 22:06:41 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 15:04:36 -0700 Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Kevin Ollivier To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3EE7920D.10406@xs4all.nl> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.8 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 5449 Lines: 126 On Wednesday, June 11, 2003, at 01:33 PM, Klaas Holwerda wrote: > > > Kevin Ollivier wrote: > >> >> >> I think it is true though that many fail to see the kinds of >> documentation logic and formatting logic that would end up in the >> source as the result of such a conversion. >> wxPython/wxPerl/wxBasic-specific notes? What about examples? What >> happens when we want to expand these 'notes' into port specific >> documentation? Should we add these into the source as well, or >> instead make each port maintain its own (largely redundant) >> documentation? I honestly wonder if some of the people contributing >> to the discussion have even read the notes that were placed on the >> wiki (http://wiki.wxwindows.org/wiki.pl?Documentation_System) because >> the Doxygen system does not meet the last two items, and I haven't >> heard much discussion as to how it could. > > Oke i see your point ( after reading ;-) ) > Some ideas. > > So how about writing our own DTD ( or just define somehow a set of XML > tags ), which contains everything we > see fit for making documentation. > I once created a simple SGML format CXXDOC that contained general > class documentation in SGML. > On the next few links you will find it, all template stuff was based > on templates for "perceps". > http://www.xs4all.nl/~kholwerd/tmp/cxxdoc.dtd > http://www.xs4all.nl/~kholwerd/texper/readme.html > > At was used/can be used on top of the docbook DTD, so all the general > editing stuff which you find in documents is still possible. > e.g When a class or member description is complicated or large , one > can use normal docbook tags to write > as far as complete books ;-) to document it. > But the key is, that such a system would contains only structured > information on the top. > So the Notes on wxPython/Perl etc, could be defined in an extra tag > etc. > And again inside such a tag one can write whatever is needed with > docbook tags. We can probably even do this with DocBook, actually. It specifies an attribute called "role" that applies to most any DocBook tag, and from what I've read is basically used for whatever purpose the author determines. So we can do something like to specify that this particular tag should only be rendered/output in the wxPython docs. Potentially, this makes us able to make any tag specific to a particular wxPort. This also would allow us to arbitrarily add new 'roles' without having to alter the DTD. > -the current class documentation can be converted to the "wxWindows > Class Doc XML" > But where possible we need special tags to define wxWindows specific > documentation. > e.g. , etc. and also and whatever > is needed. Same as above with regards to role attribute, although I'd have to take a closer look at wxWindows sources to see if this would be flexible enough. (i.e. some macros may need attributes) If not, as you say, we can just develop a few extension tags. > -we can create from "wxWindows Class Doc XML" the other format we need > ( Docbook Html Tex etc.) > This is not so complicated since most of the difficult work is already > in the Docbook stylesheets. > We just add something extra for the XML tags we use in "wxWindows > Class Doc XML". > I have experience with this part myself. > -we can link directly into the doxygen stuff is we want to, like i did > with my docbook of wxart2D. > But that is not a must, actually every other output format can have is > own needs. > > Now Doxygen comes in: > - using the docygen XML output format we can compare the "wxWindows > Class Doc XML" > and create warning where the two differ in information like > parameters etc etc. This is of course > done using XSLT to convert to some intermediate format in order to > easily diff the two. > -we can transform the doxygen XML into the "wxWindows Class Doc XML" > using XSLT, > this is ideal for new classes to generate the first documentation in > "wxWindows Class Doc XML". > After that all the notes etc can be added. This is definitely worth exploring, and probably would take care of the synchronization issues, provided the implementation is not too complex. And spitting out a wxWindows Doc template for new classes would keep the tag writing to a minimum. Just fill in the blanks. =) (Should at least reduce some concerns about having to write those messy XML tags...!) > The above does not mean that one needs to add documentation to the *.h > or *.cpp files. > Still it is possible, since a check can be made to compare the Doxygen > XML and the "wxWindows Class Doc XML". > For people writing contribs or there own stuff, or for some reason > prefer to write all docs into the Cpp/h files, the above seems > to be a good comprimize. The can use the system as an extra to the > doxygen outputs. The idea of being able to import Doxygen docs is very interesting as well, and shouldn't be too complicated if everything can be exported to XML. Of course, we probably don't need to worry about that right away, but it would be nice to have. =) > Would this solve most problems? Looks that way to me! Thanks, Kevin --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Thu Jun 12 01:56:48 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 01:56:48 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19QFSS-0007wu-00 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 01:56:48 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5BNuiYb022043 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 01:56:44 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5BNuiNQ018907 (8.12.9/3.58); Thu, 12 Jun 2003 01:56:44 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5BNuh15018906 (8.12.9/1.3); Thu, 12 Jun 2003 01:56:43 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5BNugNQ018892 (8.12.9/3.58); Thu, 12 Jun 2003 01:56:43 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 4250 invoked by uid 43863); 11 Jun 2003 23:56:25 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 4243 invoked from network); 11 Jun 2003 23:56:25 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EE7C1CA.8060308@xs4all.nl> Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 01:56:58 +0200 From: Klaas Holwerda User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org CC: Will.manley@ntlworld.com Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.3 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTE_TWICE_1, REFERENCES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 442 Lines: 24 Kevin Ollivier wrote: > > > >> Would this solve most problems? > > > Looks that way to me! Lets hope Will.manley reads this thread ;-) Will, you as a XSLT expert, what do you think? Would you have time to help us with this? Klaas --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Thu Jun 12 12:57:25 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 12:57:25 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19QPll-00014Z-00 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 12:57:25 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5CAvK1O002037 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 12:57:20 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5CArZNQ014611 (8.12.9/3.58); Thu, 12 Jun 2003 12:53:35 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5CArZ09014610 (8.12.9/1.3); Thu, 12 Jun 2003 12:53:35 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5CArYNQ014593 (8.12.9/3.58); Thu, 12 Jun 2003 12:53:34 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 23641 invoked by uid 43863); 12 Jun 2003 10:53:18 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 23634 invoked by uid 509); 12 Jun 2003 10:53:18 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Thu Jun 12 10:53:18 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!feed.news.nacamar.de!newsfeed.stueberl.de!newspeer1-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail From: "William Manley" Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows References: <3EE7C1CA.8060308@xs4all.nl> Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Message-ID: <5WYFa.9286$0d7.262575@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 11:51:13 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.2.179.21 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net 1055415041 80.2.179.21 (Thu, 12 Jun 2003 11:50:41 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 11:50:41 BST Organization: ntl Cablemodem News Service Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25982 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,PRIORITY_NO_NAME,REFERENCES version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1734 Lines: 46 > >> Would this solve most problems? > > > > Looks that way to me! > > Lets hope Will.manley reads this thread ;-) > > Will, you as a XSLT expert, what do you think? > Would you have time to help us with this? I wouldn't call myself an expert but I'd be glad to help. Your proposed system seems quite complex though, and there would be difficulty 'phasing it in' so I would suggst doing it stage by stage. As we have decided we want to use XML the first stage is deciding what xml format we want. The only concensus is that we want a new xml system, so this is the only thing we can really plan at the moment. I dont have experiance with docbook so cant really comment on that. I maight imagine we would have a structure like this: stuff button.h EVT_BUTTON(id, func) Process a wxEVT_COMMAND_BUTTON_CLICKED event, when the button is clicked EVT_SOMTHING_ELSE(id, func) Blah Blah Blah The method tags require a little more thought I think, to make them as compatable with as many of the different ports available. An XSL to convert from the new system tot he old cold be created to ease the transition. Just a few thaughts, what do you think? William Manley --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Thu Jun 12 22:52:22 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 22:52:22 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19QZ3W-0002d6-00 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 22:52:22 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5CKqGAt005563 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2003 22:52:16 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5CKqGNQ005185 (8.12.9/3.58); Thu, 12 Jun 2003 22:52:16 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5CKqFO3005184 (8.12.9/1.3); Thu, 12 Jun 2003 22:52:15 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5CKqFNQ005172 (8.12.9/3.58); Thu, 12 Jun 2003 22:52:15 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 17879 invoked by uid 43863); 12 Jun 2003 20:51:48 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 17872 invoked from network); 12 Jun 2003 20:51:48 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EE8E80B.6060703@xs4all.nl> Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 22:52:27 +0200 From: Klaas Holwerda User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action References: <3EE7C1CA.8060308@xs4all.nl> <5WYFa.9286$0d7.262575@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.0 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2456 Lines: 78 Hi William and others, Yes i agree that the first step should be to define the XML format. What about using the next as a start? http://www.xs4all.nl/~kholwerd/tmp/manual.html Is is using the next dtd: http://www.xs4all.nl/~kholwerd/tmp/cxxdoc.dtd Because of SGML it is in capital, but in XML it would be lowercase. Also ignore the tags like chapter/list/text etc, since they would be based on the docbook tags, which makes general markup more flexible. Look at the example to get the idea. The next is the top of it all, this needs to be extended with wxWindows specific stuff, e.g. CXXDOC Contains: other elements: (GENERAL | CLASS | FUNCTION | STRUCT | ENUMERATED | TYPEDEF | MACRO) So what would be missing here? I also will have another look at the doxygen XML, maybe more tags that are used in there should be taken over. Same example looks like thisin doxygen: http://www.xs4all.nl/~kholwerd/tmp/classDL__List.txt Once this first step would be clear, the next step would be how to convert wxWindows Tex to this, how terrible ;-) Thanks, Klaas William Manley wrote: >As we have decided we want to use XML the first stage is deciding what xml >format we want. The only concensus is that we want a new xml system, so >this is the only thing we can really plan at the moment. I dont have >experiance with docbook so cant really comment on that. I maight imagine we >would have a structure like this: > > > stuff > button.h > > EVT_BUTTON(id, func) > Process a wxEVT_COMMAND_BUTTON_CLICKED event, when the >button is clicked > > > EVT_SOMTHING_ELSE(id, func) > Blah Blah Blah > > > > > > > >The method tags require a little more thought I think, to make them as >compatable with as many of the different ports available. An XSL to convert >from the new system tot he old cold be created to ease the transition. > >Just a few thaughts, what do you think? > >William Manley > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 13 00:28:27 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 00:28:27 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19QaYV-0002w0-00 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 00:28:27 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5CMSLAt007332 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 00:28:21 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5CMSLNQ022433 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 00:28:21 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5CMSLnb022432 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 00:28:21 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5CMSJNQ022420 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 00:28:20 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 457 invoked by uid 43863); 12 Jun 2003 22:28:05 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 450 invoked from network); 12 Jun 2003 22:28:05 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 15:25:59 -0700 Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Kevin Ollivier To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3EE8E80B.6060703@xs4all.nl> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 3457 Lines: 109 Hi all, I think we should evaluate DocBook first, as using an existing format is much easier than making our own. DocBook is flexible enough both for writing articles or API documentation, has tags geared for conditional output, and also has XSLT sheets for many major formats, including HTML and PDF. It would save us a lot of work to go with this system, and it has quite a few tags similar to the ones below geared towards programming documentation. (i.e. , , etc.) Has anyone on this list written API documentation in DocBook? Thanks, Kevin On Thursday, June 12, 2003, at 01:52 PM, Klaas Holwerda wrote: > Hi William and others, > > Yes i agree that the first step should be to define the XML format. > > What about using the next as a start? > > http://www.xs4all.nl/~kholwerd/tmp/manual.html > > Is is using the next dtd: > http://www.xs4all.nl/~kholwerd/tmp/cxxdoc.dtd > > Because of SGML it is in capital, but in XML it would be lowercase. > Also ignore the tags like chapter/list/text etc, since they would be > based > on the docbook tags, which makes general markup more flexible. > Look at the example to get the idea. > The next is the top of it all, this needs to be extended with > wxWindows specific stuff, e.g. > CXXDOC Contains: other elements: (GENERAL | CLASS | FUNCTION | STRUCT > | ENUMERATED | TYPEDEF | MACRO) > > So what would be missing here? > > I also will have another look at the doxygen XML, maybe more tags that > are used in there > should be taken over. > Same example looks like thisin doxygen: > http://www.xs4all.nl/~kholwerd/tmp/classDL__List.txt > > Once this first step would be clear, the next step would be how to > convert wxWindows Tex to this, > how terrible ;-) > > Thanks, > > Klaas > > > William Manley wrote: > >> As we have decided we want to use XML the first stage is deciding >> what xml >> format we want. The only concensus is that we want a new xml system, >> so >> this is the only thing we can really plan at the moment. I dont have >> experiance with docbook so cant really comment on that. I maight >> imagine we >> would have a structure like this: >> >> >> stuff >> button.h >> >> EVT_BUTTON(id, func) >> Process a wxEVT_COMMAND_BUTTON_CLICKED event, >> when the >> button is clicked >> >> >> EVT_SOMTHING_ELSE(id, func) >> Blah Blah Blah >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> The method tags require a little more thought I think, to make them as >> compatable with as many of the different ports available. An XSL to >> convert >> from the new system tot he old cold be created to ease the transition. >> >> Just a few thaughts, what do you think? >> >> William Manley >> > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org > For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 13 09:50:07 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 09:50:07 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19QjK1-0005FY-00 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 09:50:07 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5D7nwR5021961 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 09:49:58 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5D7nwNQ007751 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 09:49:58 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5D7nwOe007750 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 09:49:58 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5D7nvNQ007737 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 09:49:57 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 6826 invoked by uid 43863); 13 Jun 2003 07:49:42 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 6819 invoked from network); 13 Jun 2003 07:49:42 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Sender: db348@mailgate2.signaal.nl Message-ID: <3EE9820B.15406981@signaal.nl> Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 09:49:31 +0200 From: "k. holwerda" Organization: Hollandse Signaalapparaten b.v. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; SunOS 5.8 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action References: MIME-Version: 1.0 (Generated by Clearswift ES version 4.8.1.149) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.8 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_XM version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1857 Lines: 49 Kevin Ollivier wrote: > Hi all, > > I think we should evaluate DocBook first, as using an existing format > is much easier than making our own. DocBook is flexible enough both for > writing articles or API documentation, has tags geared for conditional > output, and also has XSLT sheets for many major formats, including HTML > and PDF. It would save us a lot of work to go with this system, and it > has quite a few tags similar to the ones below geared towards > programming documentation. (i.e. , , > etc.) > > Has anyone on this list written API documentation in DocBook? Yes i did, and i posted it i believe, but at that time docbook was to limited to put in all information needed. The ones above i already used. For instance i ended up formating parameter stuff with other docbook tags. Docbook is for writing books, not for storing class documentation. If you still do so, you end up with "non information", and the whole idea of XML is to store information at a high level of abstraction, and leave the formating to other formats inside the stylesheets. Things may have improved a bit, but still i think that some higher order tags would help us. Even the role attribute will not be enough. If we can keep things simple in our XML, it will be easy to convert to complete docbook, or other formats. Again for all normal text formating we can still use the standard docbook tags. I think the best thing is to merge/extend Doxygen and our own needs, to form something on top of the docbook tag set. So we can still use all existing docbook stylesheets, only add style for our own tags. Klaas Unclassified --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 13 14:07:35 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:07:35 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19QnLC-0005rV-00 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:07:35 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5DC7QR5027074 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:07:27 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5DC7QNQ016265 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:07:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5DC7QWE016259 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:07:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5DC7PNQ016240 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 14:07:25 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 13654 invoked by uid 43863); 13 Jun 2003 12:07:10 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 13647 invoked by uid 509); 13 Jun 2003 12:07:10 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Fri Jun 13 12:07:10 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!aotearoa.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!newsfeed.vmunix.org!newspeer1-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail From: "William Manley" Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows References: <3EE7C1CA.8060308@xs4all.nl> <5WYFa.9286$0d7.262575@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> <3EE8E80B.6060703@xs4all.nl> Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 13:05:38 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.2.179.21 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net 1055505912 80.2.179.21 (Fri, 13 Jun 2003 13:05:12 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 13:05:12 BST Organization: ntl Cablemodem News Service Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:26157 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,PRIORITY_NO_NAME,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1046 Lines: 25 > Hi William and others, > > Yes i agree that the first step should be to define the XML format. > > What about using the next as a start? > > http://www.xs4all.nl/~kholwerd/tmp/manual.html [snip] > So what would be missing here? >From the new system we want to generate docs for all the languages that wx supports so that's C++, Python, Perl, Javascript, Java, Basic, Lua, and maybe some more so we dont want to restrict ourselves to c++. Whatever we decide on it has to be descriptive enough to generate all of the above, without duplicating information. > I also will have another look at the doxygen XML, maybe more tags that > are used in there > should be taken over. > Same example looks like thisin doxygen: > http://www.xs4all.nl/~kholwerd/tmp/classDL__List.txt Not too pretty, but complete. Cirtainly somthing to consider. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 13 20:41:13 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 20:41:13 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19QtU9-0006si-00 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 20:41:13 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5DIf7R5014193 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2003 20:41:07 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5DIbMNQ029483 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 20:37:22 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5DIbMXw029482 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 20:37:22 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5DIbLNQ029470 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 13 Jun 2003 20:37:22 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 10399 invoked by uid 43863); 13 Jun 2003 18:37:07 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 10391 invoked from network); 13 Jun 2003 18:37:06 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EEA19D0.9090904@xs4all.nl> Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2003 20:37:04 +0200 From: Klaas Holwerda User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action References: <3EE7C1CA.8060308@xs4all.nl> <5WYFa.9286$0d7.262575@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> <3EE8E80B.6060703@xs4all.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.0 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1070 Lines: 30 William Manley wrote: >>From the new system we want to generate docs for all the languages that wx >supports so that's C++, Python, Perl, Javascript, Java, Basic, Lua, and >maybe some more so we dont want to restrict ourselves to c++. Whatever we >decide on it has to be descriptive enough to generate all of the above, >without duplicating information > The bases is still C++, using that information i think a lot can be used to also generate documentation for non C++ languages. A style sheet could almost mimic what is done to wrap the real C++ code to other languages. But still we should add other language specific tags. I only don't know what that would be, maybe the people that write that ports can suggest something? The problem is the same in docbook programming language tags, when they are kept to global, the are not usefull enough. Klaas --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 15:17:16 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 15:17:16 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19P02u-0003uK-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 15:17:16 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h58DHBFK031086 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 15:17:12 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h58DDQgS025211 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 15:13:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h58DDQdK025210 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 15:13:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h58DDPgS025200 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 15:13:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 7328 invoked by uid 43863); 8 Jun 2003 13:13:12 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 7321 invoked by uid 509); 8 Jun 2003 13:13:12 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Sun Jun 08 13:13:12 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!feed.news.nacamar.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!ppp-8-140.29-151.libero.IT!not-for-mail From: Giuseppe Bilotta Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows Subject: Re: Documentation plan of action Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 15:08:43 +0200 Organization: Bilotta Message-ID: References: <220E163F-994C-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-8-140.29-151.libero.it (151.29.140.8) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1055077726 14692132 151.29.140.8 (16 [156467]) X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.60 Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25694 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.4 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, SIGNATURE_LONG_SPARSE version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h58DHBFK031086 Status: RO Content-Length: 3957 Lines: 72 David Elliott wrote: > Apparently a lot of people have gotten this idea that I among others=20 > absolutely hate the idea of using Doxygen. Nothing could be further=20 > from the truth. The only thing I absolutely hate is actually putting=20 > the reference documentation into the source code. I'll admit it's a=20 > personal preference, but I certainly can't be the only one here who=20 > actually likes clear and concise source code without a lot of extra=20 > fluff. And surely I'm not the only one who likes to use 80x25 VIM=20 > windows. It really irks me that many of those pushing to place the=20 > documentation into the source code dismiss the argument that it=20 > clutters the source. Unless you are using large editor windows, it=20 > will quickly become a major pain to glance through a header file. You're going to hate me for this, but VIM supports folding. You can=20 "close" the documentation lines to a single line ... Personally, I have very mixed feelings about fully documented=20 sources. On the one hand, they undoubtely increase the clutter. OTOH, when very well done they're extremely important to get a full=20 understanding of the code when you're not the original writer. (I=20 speak from personal experience.) (So no, I'm not trying to convince=20 anyone to switch to CWEB ;}) David Elliott also wrote: > However, I also realize that Te[X] is not really ideal for parsing. No= t=20 > only for computers, but also for humans. Therefore, I might suggest=20 > that we do go ahead and convert the existing manual into a more=20 > manageable format such as XML. >=20 > I feel that both of those taken together should solve the real=20 > problems. As far as I can tell, the real problems are that few people=20 > are willing to write in Te[X] (a shame, but I can't change this) and th= at=20 > the separate documentation is not very well linked to the source. To which Kevin Ollivier replied: > Well, I think the real problem with TeX is that most people are unable=20 > to put in the necessary time to update the converters. ^_- TeX syntax=20 > actually is not that bad, but XML is IMHO a better compromise between=20 > the needs of the documentation writer (easy to write but flexible=20 > syntax) and the software developer (easy to parse, consistently follows= =20 > formatting rules). I'm personally a great fan of TeX, and much less of XML, because I=20 find XML to be too verbose and clumsy to write, however easier to=20 computer-parse it might be. IOW, while it's true that XML can be=20 written in any text editor (pretty much the way TeX can) because it's=20 plain ASCII, it's also true that without some well-tune editor XML=20 editor is overkill. (I think Julian Smart expressed similar ideas.) I had a look at XMLmind's editor, as suggested by Vaclav Stavik, and=20 I find it quite good (problems with commenting/uncommenting XML, but=20 these can be solved now and then by hand-editing.) > BTW, after some research I haven't yet been able to find a LaTeX->=20 > conversion tool that I've gotten to work with the wxWindows tex files.=20 > The only tool I've found that has parsed the wxWindows TeX files=20 > properly is pyLaTeX which doesn't convert to DocBoo, but this is=20 > actually a useful tool because it parses LaTeX into Python objects and=20 > includes a pretty full-featured HTML conversion tool. That's because, as I'm sure I mentioned somewhere, wxWindows LaTeX=20 files are not exactly well structured, but instead rather "hacky"=20 (probably because they've been written to be parsed by tex2rtf). --=20 Giuseppe "Oblomov" Bilotta "Da grande lotter=F2 per la pace" "A me me la compra il mio babbo" (Altan) ("When I grow up, I will fight for peace" "My daddy will buy it for me") --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon Jun 02 19:20:32 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 02 Jun 2003 19:20:32 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Msz2-0000mt-00 for ; Mon, 02 Jun 2003 19:20:32 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h52HKR5Y001137 for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 19:20:27 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h52HGggS014665 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 19:16:42 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h52HGgVt014664 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 19:16:42 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h52HGfgS014651 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 19:16:42 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 10794 invoked by uid 43863); 2 Jun 2003 17:16:25 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 10787 invoked from network); 2 Jun 2003 17:16:25 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Mon, 2 Jun 2003 10:14:50 -0700 Subject: Re: Re[4]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Kevin Ollivier To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.1.20030531210956.03c9d960@mail.btinternet.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-19.8 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 9244 Lines: 204 Hi Julian (and all), I added a section to the wxWiki called 'Help Wanted' =) and added notes about the documentation system and also about the automatic makefile generator I was discussing with Vadim a while back. Please review and let me know if you want me to make any changes! Regarding PDF output, I found a OS X installer for DocBook that has built in tools for HTML and PDF conversion. (Other conversions are available via XSL stylesheets, they just don't provide a shell script wrapper command for it.) You can get it here: http://www.projectomega.org/subcat.php?lg=en&php=products_docbook As simple to install as any OS X application. Already installed and tested (took 5 minutes) and it converted the test doc to HTML and PDF without problems. Haven't tried anything complex yet, but I'll try and play more with it later. It is completely based on Java/Unix tools, so any Unix platform could run the same tools, but on other *nixes you may need to install the tools piecemeal and then copy over the docbook2html and docbook2pdf shell scripts. If someone generated a 'packager' script that bundled all these tools together into one tarball and installed them all at one time, it could become as easy as the OS X counterpart. BTW, Vaclav and others, I checked out the DocBook authoring capabilities in OOo, and it is not really there yet. It doesn't support all the necessary tags, and when I imported their sample doc it didn't deal with spacing, etc. very well. It also seemed rather quirky in terms of identifying the tag of the currently selected item. The support seems to be still experimental, so it could be quite some time before OOo fully supports DocBook. (As a side note, it shouldn't be too difficult to add DocBook editing support to wxMozilla in the future, as it already supports XML/XSL/CSS very well... =) Thanks, Kevin On Saturday, May 31, 2003, at 01:15 PM, Julian Smart wrote: > Hi Kevin, > > These are extremely good thoughts and useful references, > thanks! I think DocBook has to be in the top 2-3 choices. > As you say, the FEWS system would be worth investing in, > if we can locate the skills and resources. The only big doubt > I really have about DocBook is how hard it's going to > be for people to write using it. The syntax is a little > more demanding than Latex I think, and there don't seem > to be good free GUI tools, last time I looked anyway. > > I do think this is possibly the most promising approach, > not least because DocBook is a widely-used standard. > The RedHat eCos team use it and actually it wasn't > _too_ hard to do small modifications. However we had > a problem finding a decent DocBook to PDF converter > and we had to use a very expensive commercial > tool for that step. That may have changed now, I > should find out how they're doing it. > > As you say we should document the state of our > thinking on this, maybe putting your comments into > the wxWiki. > > Thanks, > > Julian > > At 11:43 31/05/2003 -0700, you wrote: > >> On Saturday, May 31, 2003, at 01:43 AM, Julian Smart wrote: >> >>> At 01:25 31/05/2003 +0200, you wrote: >>>> On Fri, 30 May 2003 23:48:53 +0200 Giuseppe Bilotta >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> GB> As you mention below, tex2rtf is under your control. The quesion >>>> GB> would then be: how much work would it be to "upgrade" tex2rtf as >>>> GB> well? >>>> >>>> I don't know as I've never worked on it but I guess it would be a >>>> non >>>> trivial task. >>> >>> Yes. The code style of Tex2RTF is horrible (I should know...) >>> >>>> GB> The question >>>> GB> is: if I took care of "upgrading" the sources to LaTeX2e and >>>> fixing >>>> GB> the various errors that they present, would someone (else) take >>>> the >>>> GB> effor to upgrade TeX2RTF and let it parse the new docs? >>>> >>>> First of all, I'd like to know which problems did you encounter >>>> with LaTeX >>>> 2e. Hopefully it was something trivial in which case we wouldn't >>>> need to >>>> change TeX2RTF at all. Otherwise I'm afraid I simply don't have >>>> time to >>>> spend on this. >>> >>> Unfortunately, me neither. Also I suspect that if we're going >>> to spend signficant time on it, it needs to be a radically new >>> system with big benefits, such as a way to keep code and docs >>> in sync. >> >> If I may offer a suggestion here, since time is the major sticking >> point, what about outlining what this new system would need to have >> (i.e. deciding on a format, etc.), so that anytime someone jumps on >> the list and says they are interested in working on updating the doc >> system, you can say "this is what we need, could you help?". =) >> >> While I'm on the subject, here are my ideas in terms of a revised >> documentation system: >> >> - DocBook/XML-based format: I'm still looking into this format, but >> so far it looks well-suited for producing software documentation. It >> has lots of programming-specific tags (i.e. for function >> definition/prototypes, parameters, menu and toolbar items, etc.), >> which lets us store API info as metadata and thus makes it easier to >> do things like produce Python/Perl/C++ specific docs from it. (their >> parameter tags separate parameter name from type info, for example) >> Also, using the 'role' attribute that works with just about any tag, >> we can flag items for publication only in certain conditions - either >> a certain language, or even a certain platform. (So, say, public >> helper functions for a particular platform could be added only to >> that platform's documentation.) It also converts to most popular >> formats, from HTML/HTMLHelp to RTF to PDF to man pages (for ref docs) >> and even LaTeX! >> >> The key advantage to this kind of format is that style changes can be >> made using XSLT, CSS or other markup tools, and thus one need not be >> a C++ programmer to alter the documentation or the conversion scripts >> (XSL-based, probably). Also, using existing, standardized formats >> means you're more likely to find tools in various languages to >> perform the conversions, and people who can read/write the formats, >> so that the burden for supporting the format and conversion tools is >> not put entirely on the wxWindows team. (Learning DocBook is pretty >> easy if you know HTML/XML.) Lastly, some of the initial conversion >> from TeX->DocBook could probably also be automated using existing >> tools. Below are some references I came across while looking into >> this, in case anyone else is interested. =) >> >> Here's a good introductory piece on the DocBook format: >> http://www-106.ibm.com/developerworks/library/l-docbk.html >> >> Here's some reference docs (Ch. #2 goes over most tags): >> http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/documentation/reference >> >> Some options in terms of output formats: >> http://docbook.org/wiki/moin.cgi/DocBookPublishingTools >> >> Lastly, here is one LaTeX->DocBook conversion tool that is available: >> http://www.cis.ohio-state.edu/~gurari/TeX4ht/mn.html#QQ1-1-3 >> >> - Function Edits Warning System (FEWS =): This would help keep >> code/docs in sync. This would basically parse the wxWindows header >> files for public function definitions, and compare them with what's >> in the class reference docs, assuming they're in DocBook format. =) >> If it hits a function for which it can't find a definition (i.e. >> different number of args, different types, etc.), it halts >> compilation of docs and spits out an error. I think this is about the >> best way to ensure that the docs don't fall behind. IMHO, v1 should >> keep it simple to increase the likelihood that someone is able to >> build it. =) Using Python and some XML tools, I would imagine this >> could be hacked together in a few days at most. Could eventually be >> extended in v2 to handle enums, read minds, implement new functions, >> etc. =) >> >> Just some thoughts to chew on! >> >> Thanks, >> >> Kevin >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org > > ======================================================================= > == > Julian Smart > mailto:julian.smart@btopenworld.com > 3 Water Street, Stamford, www.anthemion.co.uk > Lincs, U.K., PE9 2NJ +44 (0)1780 765976 > StoryLines: story structuring www.storylinescentral.com > HelpBlocks: HTML help authoring www.helpblocks.com > DialogBlocks: cross-platform dialogs www.anthemion.co.uk/dialogblocks > ======================================================================= > == > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org > For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon Jun 02 19:37:40 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 02 Jun 2003 19:37:40 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19MtFc-0000p9-00 for ; Mon, 02 Jun 2003 19:37:40 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h52Hba5Y001383 for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 19:37:36 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h52HbZgS019725 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 19:37:35 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h52HbZRg019724 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 19:37:35 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h52HbYgS019712 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 19:37:35 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 18529 invoked by uid 43863); 2 Jun 2003 17:37:20 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 18521 invoked from network); 2 Jun 2003 17:37:20 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) From: ABX To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Re[4]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Date: Mon, 02 Jun 2003 19:36:13 +0200 Organization: MDK/Ogryzek Crew Reply-To: abx@abx.art.pl Message-ID: <0n1ndvoh4l3msldt64r57o55joh3rleof7@4ax.com> References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030531210956.03c9d960@mail.btinternet.com> In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.3 required=5.5 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_FORTE version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1066 Lines: 27 Kevin Ollivier : > Already installed and =20 > tested (took 5 minutes) and it converted the test doc to HTML and PDF =20 > without problems. My two cents at this place. The issue around making PDF with the same = content as for PDF is not that simple like word "conversion" sounds. There are a few= tools for making PDF from HTML, but PDF is supposed to be also used for = printing and printed presentation has different rules than the same content on screen = - from required resoultion for images to different index and toc handling. None HTML->PDF conversion works as good as dedicated rendering from some = content described in universal way. I tried a lot for making http://abx.art.pl/pov/megapov/doc/ from DocBook sources and while I'm = still not happy about effect (there is a lot to be customized) it looks better and = better. ABX --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon Jun 02 20:09:05 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 02 Jun 2003 20:09:05 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Mtk0-0000vE-00 for ; Mon, 02 Jun 2003 20:09:05 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h52I905Y001986 for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 20:09:00 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h52I90gS026701 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 20:09:00 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h52I90MC026700 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 20:09:00 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h52I8xgS026688 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 20:08:59 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 1666 invoked by uid 43863); 2 Jun 2003 18:08:05 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 1653 invoked from network); 2 Jun 2003 18:08:05 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Mon, 2 Jun 2003 11:06:30 -0700 Subject: Re: Re[4]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Kevin Ollivier To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <0n1ndvoh4l3msldt64r57o55joh3rleof7@4ax.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-20.4 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2127 Lines: 51 On Monday, June 2, 2003, at 10:36 AM, ABX wrote: > Kevin Ollivier : >> Already installed and >> tested (took 5 minutes) and it converted the test doc to HTML and PDF >> without problems. > > My two cents at this place. The issue around making PDF with the same > content as > for PDF is not that simple like word "conversion" sounds. There are a > few tools > for making PDF from HTML, but PDF is supposed to be also used for > printing and > printed presentation has different rules than the same content on > screen - from > required resoultion for images to different index and toc handling. > None > HTML->PDF conversion works as good as dedicated rendering from some > content > described in universal way. I tried a lot for making > http://abx.art.pl/pov/megapov/doc/ from DocBook sources and while I'm > still not > happy about effect (there is a lot to be customized) it looks better > and better. Thanks for your comments (and example)! Yes, I think using DocBook as a 'universal' master format and converting from that is a good approach, as (say) the TOC in PDF format looks as one would expect for a book, while in HTML format it automatically generates links to the various pages. Are you using the Apache FOP tool to convert the DocBook sources to TXT/PDF? Have you been customizing the XSL-FO portion of the conversion? I'm impressed to see it also has a PDF-specific TOC (so you can click on the various chapters/sections to move around the document). That's very nice, and a feature many PDF-converted files lack. As for images and such, you make a good point. We would need to be careful about using high-quality (i.e. 300 dpi at least), lossless formats for the DocBook master. Do you know if the DocBook tools automatically convert images to the proper format when converting to, say, HTML? I believe it does when using FOP but I'm not sure. Thanks, Kevin --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon Jun 02 20:38:08 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 02 Jun 2003 20:38:08 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19MuC8-0000yb-00 for ; Mon, 02 Jun 2003 20:38:08 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h52Ic45Y002520 for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 20:38:04 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h52IYJgS002139 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 20:34:19 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h52IYJGB002138 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 20:34:19 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h52IYIgS002126 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 20:34:19 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 11060 invoked by uid 43863); 2 Jun 2003 18:34:02 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 11051 invoked from network); 2 Jun 2003 18:34:02 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) From: ABX To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Re[4]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Date: Mon, 02 Jun 2003 20:32:49 +0200 Organization: MDK/Ogryzek Crew Reply-To: abx@abx.art.pl Message-ID: <7p5ndvomg34013d7r36gastlsfpn2b94al@4ax.com> References: <0n1ndvoh4l3msldt64r57o55joh3rleof7@4ax.com> In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.3 required=5.5 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_FORTE version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1570 Lines: 41 Kevin Ollivier : > > I tried a lot for making > > http://abx.art.pl/pov/megapov/doc/ from DocBook sources and while I'm= =20 > > still not > > happy about effect (there is a lot to be customized) it looks better=20 > > and better. > > Thanks for your comments (and example)! Yes, I think using DocBook as a= =20 > 'universal' master format and converting from that is a good approach,=20 > as (say) the TOC in PDF format looks as one would expect for a book,=20 > while in HTML format it automatically generates links to the various=20 > pages. Are you using the Apache FOP tool to convert the DocBook sources= =20 > to TXT/PDF? TXT is obtained with lynx from HTML PDF is obtainef with FOP from FO obtained with xsltproc My toolchain works under windowses. > Have you been customizing the XSL-FO portion of the=20 > conversion? Yes. > As for images and such, you make a good point. We would need to be=20 > careful about using high-quality (i.e. 300 dpi at least), lossless=20 > formats for the DocBook master. Do you know if the DocBook tools=20 > automatically convert images to the proper format when converting to,=20 > say, HTML? I believe it does when using FOP but I'm not sure. DocBook customization allows different images for different outputs. IIRC= this is well described at http://www.sagehill.net/xml/docbookxsl/index.html ABX --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon Jun 02 20:44:34 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 02 Jun 2003 20:44:34 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19MuIL-0000zJ-00 for ; Mon, 02 Jun 2003 20:44:34 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h52IiR5Y002617 for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 20:44:29 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h52IiRgS003933 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 20:44:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h52IiRvG003930 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 20:44:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h52IiPgS003916 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 20:44:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 15849 invoked by uid 43863); 2 Jun 2003 18:44:08 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 15839 invoked from network); 2 Jun 2003 18:44:07 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EDB999B.7020708@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> Date: Mon, 02 Jun 2003 20:38:19 +0200 From: Mathieu Malaterre User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4b) Gecko/20030507 X-Accept-Language: fr, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: First shot doxygen-xml [WAS: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)] References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.1 required=5.5 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, SIGNATURE_LONG_SPARSE,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 2474 Lines: 82 Hi all, I have discussed with Vadim about the documentation of wxWindows. There has been some good proposals/links in the mailing-list I didn't know about. Anyway I'll add my stuff too. I. Using doxygen-xml - Pros: There is proof that doxygen-xml is actually used: http://vcf.sourceforge.net/ http://tinf2.vub.ac.be/~dvermeir/courses/software_engineering/projects/2003/ http://maven-plugins.sourceforge.net/doxygen/ http://voins.program.ru/windowmaker/wingsman.html A very good example: http://www.crystalclearsoftware.com/cgi-bin/boost_wiki/wiki.pl?Boost_Documentation_Format Synopsis seems to be the only doxygen concurrent: http://synopsis.sourceforge.net/ (accordinf to http://www.stack.nl/~dimitri/doxygen/links.html all except synopsis seems to have desepear). - Cons: xml is still experimental: http://www.stack.nl/~dimitri/doxygen/output.html http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?thread_id=2070070&forum_id=1985 - Related: I know umbrello is using a particular parser and it produce good xml (parse python too): http://uml.sourceforge.net/documentation.php I don't know is this project could be used (main drawback is that it doesn't parse python code): http://gccxml.org/HTML/Index.html II. RESULTS: - As for me here is my first shot, I build a small -python- script to generate doc that doxygen can parse. The result can be found here: doyxgen-html: http://www.creatis.insa-lyon.fr/~malaterre/Doxygen/html/index.html doxygen-latex: http://www.creatis.insa-lyon.fr/~malaterre/Doxygen/latex/ doxygen-xml: http://www.creatis.insa-lyon.fr/~malaterre/Doxygen/xml/index.xml WARNING: so far I ran the script only on the wxGTK src, only on wxButton and wxPanel. I am not an xml guru, so I have absolutely no idea on how good/bad/usable the doxygen-xml is...if someone can put some light on it, thanks. My mains problems so far are: - More robust script, - Event handling and Window style (don't know how to feed doxygen with), - I only parse *.tex from wxWindows/docs/latex/wx (don't what other files are for ?). Comments/suggestions are welcome mathieu Ps: Thanks for reading that far ;) -- Mathieu Malaterre CREATIS 28 Avenue du Doyen LEPINE B.P. Lyon-Montchat 69394 Lyon Cedex 03 http://www.creatis.insa-lyon.fr/~malaterre/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 00:10:29 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 00:10:29 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19MxVd-0001WV-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 00:10:29 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h52MAO5Y006354 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:10:25 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h52MAOgS006576 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:10:24 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h52MAO8d006575 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:10:24 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h52MANgS006562 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:10:23 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 27831 invoked by uid 43863); 2 Jun 2003 22:10:07 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 27823 invoked from network); 2 Jun 2003 22:10:07 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:08:55 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re: First shot doxygen-xml [WAS: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)] To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <3EDB999B.7020708@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> In-Reply-To: <3EDB999B.7020708@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.5 required=5.5 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1589 Lines: 48 On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 20:38:19 +0200 Mathieu Malaterre wrote: MM> I. Using doxygen-xml MM> MM> - Pros: MM> There is proof that doxygen-xml is actually used: .. MM> - Cons: MM> xml is still experimental: I guess it's going to improve... MM> II. RESULTS: MM> MM> - As for me here is my first shot, I build a small -python- script to MM> generate doc that doxygen can parse. Sorry, I don't really understand what does this mean? Isn't the whole idea of using doxygen that it can parse the sources directly? Or do you mean that we're going to keep the current docs and just post-process them with doxygen? I'm a bit lost by now. I was thinking about using doxygen as C++ parser (i.e. C++ -> XML translator) and I don't quite understand how do you propose to use it? MM> doyxgen-html: MM> http://www.creatis.insa-lyon.fr/~malaterre/Doxygen/html/index.html This looks good (as your previous examples did) but there are some strange things, e.g. wxFrame and wxControl don't derive from wxWindow in the class hierarchy tree for some reason. MM> My mains problems so far are: MM> - More robust script, MM> - Event handling and Window style (don't know how to feed doxygen with), MM> - I only parse *.tex from wxWindows/docs/latex/wx (don't what other MM> files are for ?). Contrib libraries, you shouldn't care about them. Regards, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 09:56:04 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 09:56:04 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19N6eK-0003zc-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 09:56:04 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h537u0oU021266 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 09:56:00 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h537txgS001489 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 09:55:59 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h537txe4001488 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 09:55:59 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h537twgS001475 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 09:55:59 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 22645 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 07:55:43 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 22638 invoked from network); 3 Jun 2003 07:55:43 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EDC5318.6050509@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 09:49:44 +0200 From: Mathieu Malaterre User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4b) Gecko/20030507 X-Accept-Language: fr, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: First shot doxygen-xml [WAS: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)] References: <3EDB999B.7020708@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-26.2 required=5.5 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 1646 Lines: 41 > Sorry, I don't really understand what does this mean? Isn't the whole idea > of using doxygen that it can parse the sources directly? Or do you mean > that we're going to keep the current docs and just post-process them with > doxygen? > > I'm a bit lost by now. I was thinking about using doxygen as C++ parser > (i.e. C++ -> XML translator) and I don't quite understand how do you > propose to use it? Exactly, but for now you have header file in include/wx/* and doc in docs/latex/wx. So my script read, let say, 'button.tex', open 'button.h' and add comments on top of each associated method. Thus this script is meant to be run only once. I don't think someone is willing to do it by hand -if someone is willing, please contact me ;)- Then the header files contains the documentation of each method, doxygen can now process them (in xml/html/rtf/man/whatever). The whole thing for now is to merge doc and src. > This looks good (as your previous examples did) but there are some strange > things, e.g. wxFrame and wxControl don't derive from wxWindow in the class > hierarchy tree for some reason. Looking at include/wx/* and include/wx/gtk/* here are the options: class wxFrame : public wxFrameBase and class WXDLLEXPORT wxFrameBase : public wxTopLevelWindow and: class wxControl : public wxControlBase I might actually work on the MSW branch, this would solve the problem I had with wxWindowGTK... regards, mathieu --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 00:51:58 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 00:51:58 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19My9m-0001eH-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 00:51:58 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h52Mps5Y007684 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:51:54 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h52MpsgS010259 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:51:54 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h52MpsMx010258 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:51:54 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h52MprgS010245 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:51:53 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 14672 invoked by uid 43863); 2 Jun 2003 22:51:36 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 14665 invoked from network); 2 Jun 2003 22:51:35 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:50:34 +0200 From: Arnout Engelen To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: First shot doxygen-xml [WAS: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)] Message-ID: <20030602225034.GC11112@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> References: <3EDB999B.7020708@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3EDB999B.7020708@creatis.insa-lyon.fr> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Face: +5<4p=wAw9CfJeb1)}#72dL9Kz#0|wnyTLORn(~.;+B3?(:8HXkA^9yzF/aHD/p~Ge]GlYyLtI3+U<""hFLN3JH}}n= X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-33.4 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 3475 Lines: 105 On Mon, Jun 02, 2003 at 08:38:19PM +0200, Mathieu Malaterre wrote: > Hi all, > > I have discussed with Vadim about the documentation of wxWindows. > There has been some good proposals/links in the mailing-list I didn't know > about. Anyway I'll add my stuff too. A while ago I tried to summarize some of the mailingist's discussion on the wiki: http://wiki.wxwindows.org/wiki.pl?Using_Doxygen_For_The_WxWindows_Documentation Maybe you could add your points there, too. Or something. The main 'con' I found was that I think we'd need extra flags in the documentation to distinguish between 'public' functions (i.e., that are part of the API and thus should be in the end-user documentation) and the 'internal' functions (i.e., functions that are used internally and might change in future versions of wx). Regards, Arnout > I. Using doxygen-xml > > - Pros: > There is proof that doxygen-xml is actually used: > > http://vcf.sourceforge.net/ > http://tinf2.vub.ac.be/~dvermeir/courses/software_engineering/projects/2003/ > http://maven-plugins.sourceforge.net/doxygen/ > http://voins.program.ru/windowmaker/wingsman.html > A very good example: > http://www.crystalclearsoftware.com/cgi-bin/boost_wiki/wiki.pl?Boost_Documentation_Format > Synopsis seems to be the only doxygen concurrent: > http://synopsis.sourceforge.net/ > (accordinf to http://www.stack.nl/~dimitri/doxygen/links.html all except > synopsis seems to have desepear). > > - Cons: > xml is still experimental: > http://www.stack.nl/~dimitri/doxygen/output.html > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?thread_id=2070070&forum_id=1985 > > - Related: > I know umbrello is using a particular parser and it produce good xml > (parse python too): > http://uml.sourceforge.net/documentation.php > > I don't know is this project could be used (main drawback is that it > doesn't parse python code): > http://gccxml.org/HTML/Index.html > > > II. RESULTS: > > - As for me here is my first shot, I build a small -python- script to > generate doc that doxygen can parse. The result can be found here: > > doyxgen-html: > http://www.creatis.insa-lyon.fr/~malaterre/Doxygen/html/index.html > > doxygen-latex: > http://www.creatis.insa-lyon.fr/~malaterre/Doxygen/latex/ > > doxygen-xml: > http://www.creatis.insa-lyon.fr/~malaterre/Doxygen/xml/index.xml > > > WARNING: so far I ran the script only on the wxGTK src, only on wxButton > and wxPanel. > > I am not an xml guru, so I have absolutely no idea on how > good/bad/usable the doxygen-xml is...if someone can put some light on > it, thanks. > > My mains problems so far are: > - More robust script, > - Event handling and Window style (don't know how to feed doxygen with), > - I only parse *.tex from wxWindows/docs/latex/wx (don't what other > files are for ?). > > > Comments/suggestions are welcome > mathieu > Ps: Thanks for reading that far ;) > > -- > Mathieu Malaterre > CREATIS > 28 Avenue du Doyen LEPINE > B.P. Lyon-Montchat > 69394 Lyon Cedex 03 > http://www.creatis.insa-lyon.fr/~malaterre/ > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org > For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 11:56:51 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 11:56:51 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19N8XD-0004H7-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 11:56:51 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h539ugoU023147 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:56:47 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h539uggS012566 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:56:42 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h539ugMK012564 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:56:42 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h539ufgS012552 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:56:41 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 19644 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 09:56:22 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 19637 invoked from network); 3 Jun 2003 09:56:22 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) From: ABX To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Re[4]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 11:55:08 +0200 Organization: MDK/Ogryzek Crew Reply-To: abx@abx.art.pl Message-ID: References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030531210956.03c9d960@mail.btinternet.com> <0n1ndvoh4l3msldt64r57o55joh3rleof7@4ax.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030603095955.03b20498@mail.btinternet.com> In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.1.20030603095955.03b20498@mail.btinternet.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.4 required=5.5 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES,USER_AGENT_FORTE version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2227 Lines: 65 Julian Smart : > > http://abx.art.pl/pov/megapov/doc/ from DocBook sources=20 > > I would be very interested in knowing what tools you used. Well... Since this documentation is dedicated for patch writers it is = already partially inside documentation :-) Chapter 5. Internals 5.6. Multi-format Documentation with DocBook http://abx.art.pl/pov/megapov/doc/online/multiformat_documentation.html If you are interested in overview on sources I have last official manual = at: http://megapov.inetart.net/documentation.html I also included my makefile at the end of = http://abx.art.pl/pov/megapov/doc/ > The output looks pretty good to me. Thanks, but there is still some work around images. Here is list of tools I use: 1. ASpell as spell checker http://aspell.sourceforge.net/ 2. Fop 0.20.3 to produce PDF from FO format http://xml.apache.org/fop/ 3. HtmlHelp Compiler http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/en-us/htmlhelp/html/hwMicrosoftHTMLHelp= Downloads.asp 4. XSLTproc for Windows to apply XSL customizations into XML sources to = get=20 various HTML and FO ouputs http://www.zlatkovic.com/projects/libxml/ 5. Lynx for DOS to convert HTML to TXT http://www.fdisk.com/doslynx/lynxport.htm 6. XML Valid to validate DocBook sources before any conversion http://www.elcel.com/products/xmlvalid.html 7. Basic customization with DocBook stylesheets http://docbook.sourceforge.net/projects/xsl/ If you choose my way I will do my best to help you, thought I already = involved in some projects including making wxWindows frontend for MegaPOV. I have heard that TEX driven DocBook->PDF toolchain produces better = results thought I could not setup it under Windowses correctly. BTW: I saw there is some effort around making website helpers for = wxWindows. I just want to point out that DocBook also has some stuff for it such that = rules of making manual and website (and slideshows) become similiar. Just visit http://docbook.sourceforge.net/ for overview. ABX --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 12:19:49 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 12:19:49 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19N8tR-0004P1-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 12:19:49 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h53AJioU023603 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:19:45 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h53AJigS022016 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:19:44 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h53AJiKp022015 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:19:44 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h53AJggS022002 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:19:43 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 24691 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 10:19:25 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 24684 invoked from network); 3 Jun 2003 10:19:25 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.1.20030603111520.03a99ed8@mail.btinternet.com> X-Sender: julian.smart@mail.btinternet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 11:19:22 +0100 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org From: Julian Smart Subject: Re: Re[4]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) In-Reply-To: References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030603095955.03b20498@mail.btinternet.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030531210956.03c9d960@mail.btinternet.com> <0n1ndvoh4l3msldt64r57o55joh3rleof7@4ax.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030603095955.03b20498@mail.btinternet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.5 required=5.5 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1422 Lines: 31 >If you choose my way I will do my best to help you, thought I already involved >in some projects including making wxWindows frontend for MegaPOV. Many thanks! We probably won't be able to look at it in detail immediately, but we will eventually, and then all this information will really come into its own. I've added info from your email to the Wiki. >BTW: I saw there is some effort around making website helpers for wxWindows. I >just want to point out that DocBook also has some stuff for it such that rules >of making manual and website (and slideshows) become similiar. Just visit >http://docbook.sourceforge.net/ for overview. That's an interesting option, thank you. Julian ========================================================================= Julian Smart mailto:julian.smart@btopenworld.com 3 Water Street, Stamford, www.anthemion.co.uk Lincs, U.K., PE9 2NJ +44 (0)1780 765976 StoryLines: story structuring www.storylinescentral.com HelpBlocks: HTML help authoring www.helpblocks.com DialogBlocks: cross-platform dialogs www.anthemion.co.uk/dialogblocks ========================================================================= --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 12:39:30 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 12:39:30 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19N9CU-0004WM-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 12:39:30 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h53AdPoU023882 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:39:26 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h53AZegS029232 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:35:40 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h53AZehf029230 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:35:40 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h53AZdgS029218 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:35:40 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 867 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 10:35:24 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 860 invoked from network); 3 Jun 2003 10:35:23 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) From: ABX To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Re[4]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 12:34:10 +0200 Organization: MDK/Ogryzek Crew Reply-To: abx@abx.art.pl Message-ID: <3auodvcqnc56g6b7vu864sulilmcfekjlt@4ax.com> References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030603095955.03b20498@mail.btinternet.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030531210956.03c9d960@mail.btinternet.com> <0n1ndvoh4l3msldt64r57o55joh3rleof7@4ax.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030603095955.03b20498@mail.btinternet.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030603111520.03a99ed8@mail.btinternet.com> In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.1.20030603111520.03a99ed8@mail.btinternet.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.4 required=5.5 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES,USER_AGENT_FORTE version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 576 Lines: 15 Julian Smart : > Many thanks! We probably won't be able to look at it in > detail immediately, but we will eventually, and then > all this information will really come into its own. I've > added info from your email to the Wiki. I have changed that info partially as I suppose to view it in public = knowledge base (very minor changes). ABX --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 12:36:18 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 12:36:18 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19N99O-0004Vr-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 12:36:18 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h53AaDoU023837 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:36:13 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h53AWSgS026692 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:32:28 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h53AWSjQ026691 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:32:28 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h53AWQgS026674 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:32:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 28681 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 10:31:58 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 28662 invoked by uid 509); 3 Jun 2003 10:31:57 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Tue Jun 03 10:31:57 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!newsfeed1.uni2.dk!skynet.be!skynet.be!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.fjserv.net!newsfeed.freenet.de!194.168.4.91.MISMATCH!newspeer1-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail From: "William Manley" Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030531210956.03c9d960@mail.btinternet.com> <0n1ndvoh4l3msldt64r57o55joh3rleof7@4ax.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030603095955.03b20498@mail.btinternet.com> Subject: Re: Re[4]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:29:21 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.2.179.21 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net 1054636139 80.2.179.21 (Tue, 03 Jun 2003 11:28:59 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 11:28:59 BST Organization: ntl Cablemodem News Service Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25251 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.9 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,PRIORITY_NO_NAME,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 631 Lines: 13 > BTW: I saw there is some effort around making website helpers for wxWindows. I > just want to point out that DocBook also has some stuff for it such that rules > of making manual and website (and slideshows) become similiar. Just visit > http://docbook.sourceforge.net/ for overview. I had a look at the xml sources and what I've been doing with the wxWebsite has some simalarities. Thanks for the tip. William Manley --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 11:04:04 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 11:04:04 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19N7i8-0004Bj-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 11:04:04 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h53940oU022282 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:04:00 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5390FgS021882 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:00:15 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5390FvT021881 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:00:15 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5390DgS021867 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:00:14 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 6209 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 08:59:52 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 6202 invoked from network); 3 Jun 2003 08:59:52 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.1.20030603095447.03ad7c08@mail.btinternet.com> X-Sender: julian.smart@mail.btinternet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 09:59:47 +0100 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org From: Julian Smart Subject: Re: Re[4]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) In-Reply-To: References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030531210956.03c9d960@mail.btinternet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2572 Lines: 58 Hi Kevin, At 10:14 02/06/2003 -0700, you wrote: >I added a section to the wxWiki called 'Help Wanted' =) and added notes >about the documentation system and also about the automatic makefile >generator I was discussing with Vadim a while back. Please review and >let me know if you want me to make any changes! This is excellent, thank you, I've added a few URL references collected from this thread. >Regarding PDF output, I found a OS X installer for DocBook that has >built in tools for HTML and PDF conversion. (Other conversions are >available via XSL stylesheets, they just don't provide a shell script >wrapper command for it.) You can get it here: > >http://www.projectomega.org/subcat.php?lg=en&php=products_docbook > >As simple to install as any OS X application. Already installed and Thanks for the link, it's looking as if the right tools are available -- I'm also interested in finding out about ABX's toolset since he's using it on Windows and getting good HTML and PDF results. >BTW, Vaclav and others, I checked out the DocBook authoring >capabilities in OOo, and it is not really there yet. It doesn't support >all the necessary tags, and when I imported their sample doc it didn't >deal with spacing, etc. very well. It also seemed rather quirky in >terms of identifying the tag of the currently selected item. The >support seems to be still experimental, so it could be quite some time >before OOo fully supports DocBook. Shame about that. Looks like we'll have to hand-edit in the mean time, or come up with our own GUI editor... > (As a side note, it shouldn't be too >difficult to add DocBook editing support to wxMozilla in the future, as >it already supports XML/XSL/CSS very well... =) That would be cool. Then we really _could_ have a GUI editor tailored to wxWindows documentation production. Julian ========================================================================= Julian Smart mailto:julian.smart@btopenworld.com 3 Water Street, Stamford, www.anthemion.co.uk Lincs, U.K., PE9 2NJ +44 (0)1780 765976 StoryLines: story structuring www.storylinescentral.com HelpBlocks: HTML help authoring www.helpblocks.com DialogBlocks: cross-platform dialogs www.anthemion.co.uk/dialogblocks ========================================================================= --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon Jun 02 23:54:55 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 02 Jun 2003 23:54:55 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19MxGZ-0001Qy-00 for ; Mon, 02 Jun 2003 23:54:55 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h52Lrp5Y005784 for ; Mon, 2 Jun 2003 23:54:51 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h52LrogS004401 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 23:53:50 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h52Lro6i004399 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 23:53:50 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h52LrngS004385 (8.12.9/3.58); Mon, 2 Jun 2003 23:53:49 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 20552 invoked by uid 43863); 2 Jun 2003 21:53:27 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 20545 invoked by uid 509); 2 Jun 2003 21:53:27 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Mon Jun 02 21:53:27 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!newsfeed1.uni2.dk!uio.no!feed.news.nacamar.de!newsfeed.stueberl.de!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!arlross.demon.co.uk!alec From: Alec Ross Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Date: Mon, 2 Jun 2003 22:48:01 +0100 Message-ID: References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030531094151.02f7d3f8@mail.btinternet.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030531210956.03c9d960@mail.btinternet.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: arlross.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1054590556 25425 158.152.7.100 (2 Jun 2003 21:49:16 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 2 Jun 2003 21:49:16 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike (32) Version 4.01 Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25222 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-7.2 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 563 Lines: 19 In article <5.0.2.1.1.20030531210956.03c9d960@mail.btinternet.com>, Julian Smart writes >Hi Kevin, > >These are extremely good thoughts and useful references, >thanks! I think DocBook has to be in the top 2-3 choices. .. Hi, Is reStructuredText http://docutils.sourceforge.net/rst.html in anybody's frame? -- Alec Ross --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 00:16:41 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 00:16:41 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Mxbd-0001XD-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 00:16:41 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h52MFb5Y006471 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:16:37 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h52MFbgS007068 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:15:37 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h52MFbDU007067 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:15:37 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h52MFagS007055 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:15:36 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 29926 invoked by uid 43863); 2 Jun 2003 22:15:19 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 29919 invoked from network); 2 Jun 2003 22:15:19 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:14:07 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <15EFDFD7-93C7-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> In-Reply-To: <15EFDFD7-93C7-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2398 Lines: 50 On Sat, 31 May 2003 17:22:10 -0700 Kevin Ollivier wrote: KO> > So before spending all this time on solving the problem maybe we KO> > should first decide just what exactly the problem is? KO> KO> One big advantage that I see with the new system is that most people KO> have dealt with HTML/XML in the past, meaning that the 'grammar' of XML KO> won't be foreign to them, and you're likely to find a larger user base KO> who can contribute and make changes. To be honest, I don't believe that LaTeX is a barrier to entry. First of all, many people (everybody in academic circles) know it. Second, we don't use anything complicated and simply by looking at the existing files you can *easily* understand how to write the docs -- and this is not just theory, people who had never used LaTeX before could do it. So the main issue here is motivation (many people who know LaTeX never write docs :-). KO> As an example, I recently looked at making changes to tex2rtf tex2rtf is a different story... I do agree that modifying it is not as easy as we might wish. KO> While assuredly the counter argument could apply for those who know KO> LaTeX but not XML, I think XML knowledge is more common and that it KO> would be worth capitalizing on that fact. The easier it is to help, the KO> more likely someone will jump in and help. =) But LaTeX is much more comfortable to write in than XML IMHO. Even if I know both (well, I think that I know XML -- what is there to "know", anyhow?) I prefer writing in LaTeX, by far. Well, maybe having written a couple of thousands of pages in it already helps too :-) KO> > P.S. "it doesn't use doxygen" is *not* a problem in itself KO> KO> Something tells me you've heard this one before. =) Actually, I'm KO> leaning towards keeping the docs and code separate, as I think it gives KO> more flexibility in terms or formatting, making ad hoc notes, etc. I'd prefer it as well. I think doxygen is great for simple projects or when you can't use anything else (i.e. it's *much* better than nothing at all). But we can do something better and it would be a pity to lose the flexibility we currently have to it. Regards, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 15:28:28 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 15:28:28 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19NBq0-0004yl-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 15:28:28 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h53DSNoU027201 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:28:23 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h53DSNgS022203 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:28:23 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h53DSNOd022202 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:28:23 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h53DSMgS022188 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:28:22 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 23880 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 13:28:05 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 23873 invoked by uid 509); 3 Jun 2003 13:28:05 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Tue Jun 03 13:28:05 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!feed.news.nacamar.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newspeer1-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9?= Fonseca Subject: Re: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) References: <15EFDFD7-93C7-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 User-Agent: slrn/0.9.7.4 (Linux) X-Inktomi-Trace: pc2-cwma1-6-cust108.swan.cable.ntl.com 1054646806 21120 81.101.208.108 (3 Jun 2003 13:26:46 GMT) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 13:26:47 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.1.224.4 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net 1054646807 80.1.224.4 (Tue, 03 Jun 2003 14:26:47 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 14:26:47 BST Organization: ntl News Service Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25267 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h53DSNoU027201 Status: RO Content-Length: 2777 Lines: 54 In article , Vadim Zeitlin wrote= : > On Sat, 31 May 2003 17:22:10 -0700 Kevin Ollivier w= rote: >=20 > KO> > P.S. "it doesn't use doxygen" is *not* a problem in itself > KO>=20 > KO> Something tells me you've heard this one before. =3D) Actually, I'm= =20 > KO> leaning towards keeping the docs and code separate, as I think it g= ives=20 > KO> more flexibility in terms or formatting, making ad hoc notes, etc.=20 >=20 > I'd prefer it as well. I think doxygen is great for simple projects or > when you can't use anything else (i.e. it's *much* better than nothing = at > all). But we can do something better and it would be a pity to lose the > flexibility we currently have to it. I've used most tools people have mentioned in (DocBook, LaTeX, Doxygen, ..) and I think that you're doing a bad move by dismissing Doxygen or similar tools. Why? Several reasons: - You're writing techinal reference documentation. Not a book about wxWindows. The object of the documentation is the code itself. Having the documentation in the code will benefit of the same revision control of the code, and can be simultaneously updated. - Flexibility isn't everything. There's nothing more flexible than writing by hand in all the desired formats(!), but something tells me than nobody wants to spend the rest of their lifes writing docs. - Formats _do_ change, but a computer language (such as C++) is here for quite some time and will stay for much longer (probably even more than the XML formats such as DocBook, and at least as long as wxWindows uses it). If in ten years from now you don't want to change your documentation to the format of the day you should take advantage of that. A tool such as Doxygen can be easily be extended to new formats, and probably already will handle in ten years the formats of then. - Again on flexibility, a open-source tool such as Doxygen, allows anybody to modify to suit their specific needs. Although this isn't excuse for everything, it gives you your such acclaimed flexibility, in case you actually need it. In summary, if you were writing a book about wxWindows, I'd strongly suggest SGML DocBook. Since you're writing an API reference manual instead, I strongly suggest extracting the documentation from the source, and Doxygen seems to be the best available tool for that. If you're trying to do a little of both I think you shouldn't: seperate what you have in a User Manual and a Reference Manual. Just my 2c. Jos=E9 Fonseca --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Thu Jun 05 23:09:28 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Thu, 05 Jun 2003 23:09:28 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19O1zE-0004Rg-00 for ; Thu, 05 Jun 2003 23:09:28 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h55L9NQB012710 for ; Thu, 5 Jun 2003 23:09:23 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h55L9NgS005105 (8.12.9/3.58); Thu, 5 Jun 2003 23:09:23 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h55L9N5Z005104 (8.12.9/1.3); Thu, 5 Jun 2003 23:09:23 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h55L9MgS005093 (8.12.9/3.58); Thu, 5 Jun 2003 23:09:22 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 17248 invoked by uid 43863); 5 Jun 2003 21:09:02 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 17241 invoked from network); 5 Jun 2003 21:09:02 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Thu, 5 Jun 2003 17:07:51 -0400 Subject: Re: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: David Elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-20.4 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2885 Lines: 68 On Tuesday, June 3, 2003, at 09:26 AM, Jos=E9 Fonseca wrote: > In article , Vadim Zeitlin=20 > wrote: >> I'd prefer it as well. I think doxygen is great for simple projects=20= >> or >> when you can't use anything else (i.e. it's *much* better than=20 >> nothing at >> all). But we can do something better and it would be a pity to lose=20= >> the >> flexibility we currently have to it. > > I've used most tools people have mentioned in (DocBook, LaTeX, = Doxygen, > ...) and I think that you're doing a bad move by dismissing Doxygen or > similar tools. Why? Several reasons: > [snip 100 lines of opinion] First of all, this topic has been discussed to death several times in=20 the past. I've come back from a week long trip to 1000+ messages=20 between the two mailing lists. This is one I really could have done=20 without having to skim through. So now I'm replying to it (grr). I've tried to keep an open mind about the possibility of using Doxygen,=20= but it's been many months since I've been following this discussion and=20= it's still spinning in circles. The bottom line is that if we had=20 little to no documentation, Doxygen would be an improvement. We have=20 documentation. In fact, there is a lot of documentation. I'm still=20 not convinced that there will be any difference between writing a blurb=20= of documentation in a tex file or writing it in a .cpp or .h file. The=20= only insurmountable difference between the current system and doxygen=20 is that the former requires authors to have two windows open. =20 Everything else that Doxygen does can and should be done without=20 rocking the boat. The bottom line is that these glowing reviews of Doxygen (more like=20 sales pitches) mention the pros but not the cons. It's all been=20 discussed to death and the only workable solution I have seen is to=20 write a program that cross checks the header files with documentation=20 to maintain consistency. You might even use Doxygen (without using any doxygen comments in the=20 source) to do the bulk of the work, perhaps running it through a python=20= script that cross-checks against the tex or maybe even the HTML=20 generated from the tex. Furthermore, you might use Doxygen (or a=20 modified Doxygen) to generate a pretty class hierarchy that could link=20= to the existing documentation. I did note someone posted a PERL hack=20 while I was gone that supposedly printed the class hierarchy (for all I=20= know it just runs rm -rf / :-). I also noticed a python script=20 relating to this discussion. Both of these are good efforts and are=20 seriously on the right track. -Dave --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 06 04:48:17 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 04:48:17 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19O7H6-0006M9-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 04:48:16 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h562mCQB022460 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 04:48:12 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h562iRgS000206 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 04:44:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h562iRiE000205 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 04:44:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h562iQgS000175 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 04:44:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 17253 invoked by uid 43863); 6 Jun 2003 02:44:12 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 17246 invoked by uid 509); 6 Jun 2003 02:44:12 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Fri Jun 06 02:44:12 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!newsfeed1.uni2.dk!uio.no!feed.news.nacamar.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!194.168.4.91.MISMATCH!newspeer1-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9?= Fonseca Subject: Re: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 User-Agent: slrn/0.9.7.4 (Linux) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 02:42:18 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 81.101.208.10 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net 1054867338 81.101.208.10 (Fri, 06 Jun 2003 03:42:18 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 03:42:18 BST Organization: ntl Cablemodem News Service Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25562 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h562mCQB022460 Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 4410 Lines: 87 In article , David Ellio= tt wrote: > First of all, this topic has been discussed to death several times in > the past. =20 I guessed that much but I was arrogant enough to think my input could add some value to the dicussion. > I've come back from a week long trip to 1000+ messages between the two > mailing lists. This is one I really could have done without having to > skim through. So now I'm replying to it (grr). Then why did you replied? Especially if you did not read it... > I've tried to keep an open mind about the possibility of using > Doxygen, but it's been many months since I've been following this > discussion and it's still spinning in circles. The bottom line is > that if we had little to no documentation, Doxygen would be an > improvement. =20 This is ludicrous! You actually ignore that it is being used in projects much bigger than wxWindows... > We have documentation. In fact, there is a lot of documentation. I'm > still not convinced that there will be any difference between writing > a blurb of documentation in a tex file or writing it in a .cpp or .h > file. The only insurmountable difference between the current system > and doxygen is that the former requires authors to have two windows > open. Everything else that Doxygen does can and should be done > without rocking the boat. >=20 > The bottom line is that these glowing reviews of Doxygen (more like > sales pitches) mention the pros but not the cons. =20 I gave an objective review and it _was't_ of Doxygen - my point was on generating the documentation from comments the source rather than the _exact_ tool used for the extraction. If you actually read it you'll notice that at all times, Doxygen was merely used as an example. I guess that it must have been the fact this subject has been thoroughly discussed here and your confessed prejudice against Doxygen that made you overlook that. I also have no idea of what 'cons' you want hear. Most of the documentation extraction tools available (see e.g. http://www.codeassets.com/doc_tools.htm ) do very well what they're intended to do - extraction of the embedded comments together with the code structure. The differences are mostly a matter of supported languages, output formats, some bell & wistles, and some personal taste.=20 > It's all been discussed to death and the only workable solution I have > seen is to write a program that cross checks the header files with > documentation to maintain consistency. >=20 > You might even use Doxygen (without using any doxygen comments in the > source) to do the bulk of the work, perhaps running it through a > python script that cross-checks against the tex or maybe even the HTML > generated from the tex. Furthermore, you might use Doxygen (or a > modified Doxygen) to generate a pretty class hierarchy that could link > to the existing documentation. =20 Trying to sync external documentation with the code is what I'd really call "spinning in circles"... Having the API reference docs seperate from the code implies some redundancy (in the declarations, in the common methods, etc.) and redundancy means duplicate work. I can't see it in another way. > I did note someone posted a PERL hack while I was gone that supposedly > printed the class hierarchy (for all I know it just runs rm -rf / :-). > I also noticed a python script relating to this discussion. =20 Although these scripts are undoubtfully very interesting exercises, they are duplicating functionality which is already available in the documentation extraction tools. It's like re-inventing the weel, but this time, making it square! It would make much more sense to pick one of the existing perl or python documentation extraction tools, modify it to accept tex/latex tags, and start from there. > Both of these are good efforts and are seriously on the right track. I disagree but this is a moot point. Alan Cox once said "those who do the work, get to choose how to do it, and rightfully so", and I couldn't agree more with him. So regardless of the means chosen by the wxWindows documenters, they'll always have my deepest appreciation. Jos=E9 Fonseca --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 06 08:23:41 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 08:23:41 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OAdZ-0006uu-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 08:23:41 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h566NaLs027948 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 08:23:37 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h566JpgS012434 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 08:19:51 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h566Jonv012433 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 08:19:50 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h566JngS012423 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 08:19:50 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 18997 invoked by uid 43863); 6 Jun 2003 06:19:33 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 18989 invoked from network); 6 Jun 2003 06:19:33 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2003 02:19:27 -0400 Subject: Re: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: David Elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-20.4 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 3566 Lines: 93 On Thursday, June 5, 2003, at 10:42 PM, Jos=E9 Fonseca wrote: > > In article , David=20 > Elliott wrote: >> First of all, this topic has been discussed to death several times in >> the past. > > I guessed that much but I was arrogant enough to think my input could > add some value to the dicussion. > And I see that you're still arrogant enough to reply without reading=20 the archives. This mail will be my last in this thread. >> I've come back from a week long trip to 1000+ messages between the = two >> mailing lists. This is one I really could have done without having = to >> skim through. So now I'm replying to it (grr). > > Then why did you replied? Especially if you did not read it... > Oh, but I did take the time to read it. The grr is to myself for=20 bothering to do so in the first place. >> I've tried to keep an open mind about the possibility of using >> Doxygen, but it's been many months since I've been following this >> discussion and it's still spinning in circles. The bottom line is >> that if we had little to no documentation, Doxygen would be an >> improvement. > > This is ludicrous! You actually ignore that it is being used in=20 > projects > much bigger than wxWindows... > Yes, I know that. It has absolutely nothing to do with what I was=20 talking about here. It does however directly relate to one of the=20 points I touched on earlier that many users of a tool does not=20 necessarily make it appropriate for use with wxWindows. [snip] I'm not going to bother replying to all of that. I did in my last=20 message. I and others have done it many many times before. > >> I did note someone posted a PERL hack while I was gone that = supposedly >> printed the class hierarchy (for all I know it just runs rm -rf / = :-). >> I also noticed a python script relating to this discussion. > > Although these scripts are undoubtfully very interesting exercises,=20 > they > are duplicating functionality which is already available in the > documentation extraction tools. It's like re-inventing the weel, but > this time, making it square! > Actually, I think it's a damn fine way to program. They are in fact=20 very interesting exercises. And eventually it'll all be put together. =20= I applaud the efforts of those who work on these scripts because they=20 are playing a big role in the eventual creation of the system we've=20 long ago agreed to build. > It would make much more sense to pick one of the existing perl or=20 > python > documentation extraction tools, modify it to accept tex/latex tags, = and > start from there. > Yes, I know that, which is why I suggested one of the existing tools be=20= used as part of the programming process if it would make the job easier. >> Both of these are good efforts and are seriously on the right track. > > I disagree but this is a moot point. Alan Cox once said "those who do > the work, get to choose how to do it, and rightfully so", and I=20 > couldn't > agree more with him. So regardless of the means chosen by the=20 > wxWindows > documenters, they'll always have my deepest appreciation. > The wxWindows documenters (at least for the documentation we are=20 talking about) are primarily (and most thankfully) the coders. In=20 response to that last paragraph, to be quite frank: no shit. -Dave --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 06 10:24:22 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 10:24:22 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OCWM-00079t-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 10:24:22 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h568OILs029590 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 10:24:18 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h568OIgS008306 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 10:24:18 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h568OI6k008305 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 10:24:18 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h568OGgS008280 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 10:24:17 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 11181 invoked by uid 43863); 6 Jun 2003 08:24:02 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 11173 invoked from network); 6 Jun 2003 08:24:01 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2003 10:05:54 +0200 From: Arnout Engelen To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Message-ID: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Face: +5<4p=wAw9CfJeb1)}#72dL9Kz#0|wnyTLORn(~.;+B3?(:8HXkA^9yzF/aHD/p~Ge]GlYyLtI3+U<""hFLN3JH}}n= X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-33.4 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1238 Lines: 31 On Fri, Jun 06, 2003 at 02:42:18AM +0000, Jos? Fonseca wrote: > > In article , David Elliott wrote: > > First of all, this topic has been discussed to death several times in > > the past. > > I guessed that much but I was arrogant enough to think my input could > add some value to the dicussion. In response to another message saying 'this has been discusses at length before', I created the following summary: http://wiki.wxwindows.org/wiki.pl?Using_Doxygen_For_The_WxWindows_Documentation My own impression, after reading previous threads on the issue, is that it'd be generally agreed to be a nice idea to have documentation generated by doxygen, but there are practical issues that might make this unfeasible. I believe *all* of the 'but Doxygen can't do ...' statements have since moved from 'outstanding issues' to 'solved issues', to the point that 'outstanding issues' is now empty. I'm sure this isn't complete, and by all means add to it. Kind regards, Arnout --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 06 15:56:22 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 15:56:22 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OHhd-0001LZ-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 15:56:21 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h56DuHLs006286 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 15:56:17 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h56DqWgS014640 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 15:52:32 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h56DqWn1014639 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 15:52:32 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h56DqVgS014629 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 15:52:31 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 24715 invoked by uid 43863); 6 Jun 2003 13:52:14 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 24708 invoked by uid 509); 6 Jun 2003 13:52:13 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Fri Jun 06 13:52:13 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!feed.news.nacamar.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!easynews.net!newsfeed3.easynews.net!feeder.news.heanet.ie!server5.netnews.ja.net!news.swman.net.uk!not-for-mail From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9?= Fonseca Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows Subject: Re: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Date: 6 Jun 2003 13:47:53 GMT Organization: South Wales MAN News Service Message-ID: References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> NNTP-Posting-Host: mefriss1.swan.ac.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Trace: news.swman.net.uk 1054907273 25953 137.44.16.172 (6 Jun 2003 13:47:53 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@news.swman.net.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: 6 Jun 2003 13:47:53 GMT User-Agent: slrn/0.9.7.4 (Linux) Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25591 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h56DuHLs006286 Status: RO Content-Length: 3221 Lines: 66 In article <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl>, Arnout Engelen wr= ote: > On Fri, Jun 06, 2003 at 02:42:18AM +0000, Jos? Fonseca wrote: >>=20 >> In article , David El= liott wrote: >> > First of all, this topic has been discussed to death several times i= n >> > the past. =20 >>=20 >> I guessed that much but I was arrogant enough to think my input could >> add some value to the dicussion. >=20 > In response to another message saying 'this has been discusses at lengt= h > before', I created the following summary: >=20 > http://wiki.wxwindows.org/wiki.pl?Using_Doxygen_For_The_WxWindows_Doc= umentation >=20 Interesting. > My own impression, after reading previous threads on the issue, is > that it'd be generally agreed to be a nice idea to have documentation > generated by doxygen, but there are practical issues that might make > this unfeasible. I believe *all* of the 'but Doxygen can't do ...' > statements have since moved from 'outstanding issues' to 'solved > issues', to the point that 'outstanding issues' is now empty. Even most of the cons there focus Doxygen formatting or implementation issues. The real arguments there against using documentation extractions in general are (in decreasing importance): - it's a *lot* of work - the source gets 'cluttered' - it becomes increasingly difficult for a non-developer to modify it That last third argument has really no ground, and even if it had, according to David it's the developers who write, and it's always one less window open. Regarding the second, I know of some poeple who feel the same for _any_ kind of comment, but it's always subjective. The ammount of documentation seen for example in http://www.wxwindows.org/manuals/2.4.0/wx46.htm#wxbutton would still be little compared with the surrounding code. The first is effectively concerning, and gets more as time goes by. Some scripts can be written to help this, or [non-developer] volunteers can do the grunt of the work, but in the end it's a matter of cost/benefit. Sadly it seems clear that most people here don't see any benefit in having the docs in the source. I quite frankly don't know of any other project which tries to sync the docs with the source wihout actually generating the former from the latter, and it seems quite an unnatural thing to do. Most projects seem to actually be moving on the opposite direction and even languages (e.g. Python) seem to move in the direction of literate programming, with direct support for documentation. This is why I think this move will cause latter regret. > I'm sure this isn't complete, and by all means add to it.=20 I may just add that for non-enduser public methods one can also use the '\internal' tag in Doxygen (see http://www.stack.nl/~dimitri/doxygen/commands.html#cmdinternal ). Another alternative is to document the regular menthods in the .hxx and the non-public in the .cxx, and only include the former in the end-user docs. Jos=E9 Fonseca --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 06 17:28:03 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 17:28:03 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OJ8N-0001bD-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 17:28:03 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h56FRxLs007977 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:27:59 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h56FRwgS007599 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:27:58 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h56FRwrV007598 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:27:58 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h56FRvgS007587 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:27:58 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 19761 invoked by uid 43863); 6 Jun 2003 15:27:39 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 19754 invoked from network); 6 Jun 2003 15:27:38 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:26:23 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[10]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h56FRxLs007977 Status: RO Content-Length: 1719 Lines: 41 On 6 Jun 2003 13:47:53 GMT Jos=E9 Fonseca wrote= : JF> Sadly it seems clear that most people here don't see any benefit in JF> having the docs in the source. I don't know for "most" but I personally clearly do see it. But I also s= ee that it has _some_ disadvantages (having the docs separately is more flexible, for example it would be pretty much impossible to document some macro-based code using doxygen -- ok, this code is hopefully to disappear in a few years time by there are other examples when you'd like to have something slightly different in the docs than in the sources) but even th= en I still think that the advantages outweigh them. *But* there are 2 problems with doxygen: 1. the important one is the "backporting" the existing docs to the header= s 2. much less important one but which is still somewhat distrubing to me personally is these small disadvantages of using doxygen -- I'm afraid I could be just a bit tired of people claiming that doxygen is the Hol= y Grail whereas I think that it is not -- and that nothing is, anyhow. And although I disagree with much of what David wrote but he is correct about one thing: the discussions about using doxygen happen frequently he= re since at least 3 or 4 years and so far nobody has yet addresses the most important problem with switching to it, that is the (1) above. As long as this is not done, all these discussions stay just this -- discussions without any practical consequences. Regards, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 06 17:36:41 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 17:36:41 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OJGj-0001cx-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 17:36:41 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h56FabLs008187 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:36:37 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h56FabgS010007 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:36:37 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h56FabZE010006 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:36:37 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h56FaagS009995 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:36:36 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 23452 invoked by uid 43863); 6 Jun 2003 15:36:21 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 23438 invoked from network); 6 Jun 2003 15:36:21 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.1.20030606163115.0173c2a0@mail.btinternet.com> X-Sender: julian.smart@mail.btinternet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 16:36:15 +0100 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org From: Julian Smart Subject: Re[10]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) In-Reply-To: References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-27.0 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1377 Lines: 28 At 17:26 06/06/2003 +0200, you wrote: > And although I disagree with much of what David wrote but he is correct >about one thing: the discussions about using doxygen happen frequently here >since at least 3 or 4 years and so far nobody has yet addresses the most >important problem with switching to it, that is the (1) above. As long as >this is not done, all these discussions stay just this -- discussions >without any practical consequences. I think we'll probably sort it out this year, and these discussions _will_ have helped. I'll try talk to talk to some more people with XML/professional tech manual generation experience. Julian ========================================================================= Julian Smart mailto:julian.smart@btopenworld.com 3 Water Street, Stamford, www.anthemion.co.uk Lincs, U.K., PE9 2NJ +44 (0)1780 765976 StoryLines: story structuring www.storylinescentral.com HelpBlocks: HTML help authoring www.helpblocks.com DialogBlocks: cross-platform dialogs www.anthemion.co.uk/dialogblocks ========================================================================= --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 06 17:46:03 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 17:46:03 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OJPn-0001eX-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 17:46:03 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h56FjwLs008356 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:45:59 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h56FjwgS011466 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:45:58 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h56FjwYU011465 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:45:58 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h56FjvgS011454 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:45:58 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 27283 invoked by uid 43863); 6 Jun 2003 15:45:42 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 27274 invoked from network); 6 Jun 2003 15:45:42 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2003 16:45:40 +0100 (BST) From: chris elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Re[10]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-25.6 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,IN_REP_TO, KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_PINE version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 772 Lines: 25 On Fri, 6 Jun 2003, Vadim Zeitlin wrote: > On 6 Jun 2003 13:47:53 GMT Jos=E9 Fonseca wrote= : >=20 > JF> Sadly it seems clear that most people here don't see any benefit in > JF> having the docs in the source. >=20 > I don't know for "most" but I personally clearly do see it. But I also s= ee I know a lot of people on the list(s) have asked for it, but like most things, its only likely to happen if someone decides to do this as their contribution to the general good I am sure good patches on SF would be gratefully received chris --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 06 18:18:38 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 18:18:38 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OJvK-0001lN-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 18:18:38 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h56GIXLs009024 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 18:18:34 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h56GIXgS015585 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 18:18:33 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h56GIXg9015583 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 18:18:33 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h56GIWgS015573 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 18:18:33 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 10260 invoked by uid 43863); 6 Jun 2003 16:18:17 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 10253 invoked by uid 509); 6 Jun 2003 16:18:16 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Fri Jun 06 16:18:16 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!feed.news.nacamar.de!newsfeed.vmunix.org!newspeer1-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9?= Fonseca Subject: Re: Re[10]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 User-Agent: slrn/0.9.7.4 (Linux) Message-ID: <963Ea.2254$0d7.62602@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 16:15:01 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 81.101.208.10 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net 1054916101 81.101.208.10 (Fri, 06 Jun 2003 17:15:01 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 17:15:01 BST Organization: ntl Cablemodem News Service Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25612 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h56GIXLs009024 Status: RO Content-Length: 2981 Lines: 53 In article , Vadim Zeitlin wrote= : > On 6 Jun 2003 13:47:53 GMT Jos=E9 Fonseca wro= te: >=20 > JF> Sadly it seems clear that most people here don't see any benefit in > JF> having the docs in the source. >=20 > I don't know for "most" but I personally clearly do see it. But I > also see that it has _some_ disadvantages (having the docs separately > is more flexible, for example it would be pretty much impossible to > document some macro-based code using doxygen -- ok, this code is > hopefully to disappear in a few years time by there are other > examples when you'd like to have something slightly different in the > docs than in the sources) but even then I still think that the > advantages outweigh them. General Macros usually work ok with doxygen (see e.g., http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/projects/dri/doxygen/core/macros_8h.html). C pre-processor templates, i.e., including a special C header and defining a few macros to alter its expansion, is that is very tricky to do with Doxygen. Unfortunately this is not an uncommon situation in low-level C programming. > *But* there are 2 problems with doxygen: >=20 > 1. the important one is the "backporting" the existing docs to the > headers 2. much less important one but which is still somewhat > distrubing to me personally is these small disadvantages of using > doxygen -- I'm afraid I could be just a bit tired of people claiming > that doxygen is the Holy Grail whereas I think that it is not -- and > that nothing is, anyhow. Of course. Several times was unhappy with the Doxygen output (formatting, layout, verbosity, etc). But also I've never seen that as an disadvantage per se, but more as annoyances. One day I'm going to crack-open Doxygen and fix all those things that annoy me and send a patch upstream. If not accepted, then no problem - I'll just keep using the modified version myself. Of course that, this will only happen when the formatting is the only and last concern. But usually it isn't. Gettin= g the content there usually is. > And although I disagree with much of what David wrote but he is > correct about one thing: the discussions about using doxygen happen > frequently here since at least 3 or 4 years and so far nobody has yet > addresses the most important problem with switching to it, that is > the (1) above. As long as this is not done, all these discussions > stay just this -- discussions without any practical consequences. Seems like a chicken and egg problem to me. I'll surely not put my money where my mouth is - I already have my share of ongoing good deeds. In the chicken and egg business I see msyelf as the farmer, who will eat either the chicken or the egg! :)) Jose Fonseca --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 06 19:17:49 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 19:17:49 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OKqb-0001vX-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 19:17:49 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h56HHjLs010258 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 19:17:45 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h56HE0gS022898 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 19:14:00 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h56HE0mV022897 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 19:14:00 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h56HDxgS022886 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 19:13:59 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 975 invoked by uid 43863); 6 Jun 2003 17:13:39 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 941 invoked by uid 509); 6 Jun 2003 17:13:39 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Fri Jun 06 17:13:38 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!uio.no!newsfeed.vmunix.org!newspeer1-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!newsfep4-winn.server.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail From: "William Manley" Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <963Ea.2254$0d7.62602@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> Subject: Re: Re[10]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2003 18:12:16 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.2.179.21 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: newsfep4-winn.server.ntli.net 1054919518 80.2.179.21 (Fri, 06 Jun 2003 18:11:58 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 18:11:58 BST Organization: ntl Cablemodem News Service Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25618 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.9 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,PRIORITY_NO_NAME,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 806 Lines: 12 > Of course. Several times was unhappy with the Doxygen output > (formatting, layout, verbosity, etc). But also I've never seen that as an > disadvantage per se, but more as annoyances. One day I'm going to > crack-open Doxygen and fix all those things that annoy me and send a > patch upstream. If not accepted, then no problem - I'll just keep using > the modified version myself. Of course that, this will only happen when > the formatting is the only and last concern. But usually it isn't. Getting > the content there usually is. You can just use XSLT on the XML output to modify the output --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Jun 07 00:34:53 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 00:34:53 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OPnQ-0002am-00 for ; Sat, 07 Jun 2003 00:34:53 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h56MYmLs016490 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2003 00:34:48 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h56MYmgS019987 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 00:34:48 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h56MYmuU019986 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 00:34:48 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h56MYkgS019976 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 00:34:47 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 11962 invoked by uid 43863); 6 Jun 2003 22:34:32 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 11954 invoked from network); 6 Jun 2003 22:34:32 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EE1185B.6080103@lehigh.edu> Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 18:40:27 -0400 From: John Labenski Reply-To: jrl1@Lehigh.EDU User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.3.1) Gecko/20030428 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)gen References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <963Ea.2254$0d7.62602@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> In-Reply-To: <963Ea.2254$0d7.62602@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-16.3 required=5.5 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 1959 Lines: 48 Would it be possible to merely put up a copy of the wxWindows source code as run through doxygen at the wxWindows site. I was thinking somewhere right on the documentation page there could be a link wxWindows 2.4.0 manual: for the latest official version wxWindows 2.5.x manual: updated nightly from CVS wxWindows doxygen source code map I'm sure that for the whole wxWindows library it would take quite a bit of space, but if the space is available it couldn't possibly be a bad thing. Regardless of whether there's comments or not, the doxygen "documentation" with diagrams and all is very useful. It beats digging through the headers and source by a long shot and can be used by newbies and experts alike to visualize and understand the source. Currently - read the manual for some function, don't get it, grep wxSomeClass include/wx, ok not defined in header grep wxSomeClass src/gtk, oops it's in common... no, try generic.. grrrrr less somefile.cpp, search for the function oops its in some other base class as DoFunction grep grep grep... open up mail program ask question (maybe it's not that bad, but it can be) Doxygen on the website read the manual, don't get it open browser, click on alphabetical - wxSomeClass click on wxSomeClass::SomeFunction click view source, click DoFunction This has been discussed and fought over for quite some time without any tangable results. Perhaps just putting it out there and seeing what people think would be a good first step. People have already made config files tailored to wxWindows, the initial job is done. Later on you can create a shell script to run doxygen and then postprocess... The only thing you have to loose is disk space! Regards, -John Labenski --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Jun 07 02:20:10 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 02:20:10 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19ORRK-0007Pw-00 for ; Sat, 07 Jun 2003 02:20:10 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h570K5Ls022584 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2003 02:20:05 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h570K5gS026103 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 02:20:05 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h570K5mH026102 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 02:20:05 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h570K4gS026092 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 02:20:04 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 364 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 00:19:50 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 357 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 00:19:50 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 02:18:49 +0200 From: Arnout Engelen To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org, jrl1@Lehigh.EDU Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)gen Message-ID: <20030607001849.GB3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <963Ea.2254$0d7.62602@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> <3EE1185B.6080103@lehigh.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3EE1185B.6080103@lehigh.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Face: +5<4p=wAw9CfJeb1)}#72dL9Kz#0|wnyTLORn(~.;+B3?(:8HXkA^9yzF/aHD/p~Ge]GlYyLtI3+U<""hFLN3JH}}n= X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-33.4 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1650 Lines: 44 On Fri, Jun 06, 2003 at 06:40:27PM -0400, John Labenski wrote: > Would it be possible to merely put up a copy of the wxWindows source > code as run through doxygen at the wxWindows site. I was thinking > somewhere right on the documentation page there could be a link Well. I did a small test run, put it up at: http://www.bzzt.net/~wxwindows/doxygen/html/ based on configfile http://www.bzzt.net/~wxwindows/doxygen/wxWindows/doxconfig I propose we use this as a testing place to see whether (or not!) doxygen docs would be useful (in addition to the current docs). Feel free to mail me anything that might be nice to add, then this url will reflect the 'state of the art' as far as doxygen is concerned. I look forward to hearing your additions. What I did so far: - make a first guess at what files should be parsed - added '#ifndef DOC_DONT_EXTRACT' to: - 2 private structures in include/wx/hashmap.h - include/wx/dbkeyg.h The first issues are comeing up :) I see not all public functions of the wxMBConv class are shown. I wonder why. Note that I'm not a doxygen-groupy that does this to push doxygen, rather I still think doxygen might be promising and it'd be fun to try it out, while helping the discussion focus. Eventually converting the existing documentation (it is a *lot*) to a structured format (beit doxygen or xml) would be great, but I see *many* problems there. Challenging, though. Kind regards, Arnout --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Jun 07 02:43:04 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 02:43:04 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19ORnU-0001PG-00 for ; Sat, 07 Jun 2003 02:43:04 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h570gxLs022818 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2003 02:43:00 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h570gxgS027076 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 02:42:59 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h570gxrj027075 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 02:42:59 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h570gvgS027064 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 02:42:58 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 3173 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 00:42:44 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 3166 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 00:42:44 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EE133E7.7020507@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 20:37:59 -0400 From: Matt Gregory User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030529 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)gen References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <963Ea.2254$0d7.62602@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> <3EE1185B.6080103@lehigh.edu> <20030607001849.GB3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> In-Reply-To: <20030607001849.GB3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-29.5 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 645 Lines: 18 Arnout Engelen wrote: > Well. I did a small test run, put it up at: > > http://www.bzzt.net/~wxwindows/doxygen/html/ I don't know, I've been messing around with Doxygen for the past few days, and although it's cool having the docs in the code, being forced to comment everything and re-audit the code, I think the output it produces pretty much sucks, IMO. They need some type of template system, then it would be sweet. Matt Gregory --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Jun 07 14:06:56 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 14:06:56 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OcTI-0006fX-00 for ; Sat, 07 Jun 2003 14:06:56 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57C6qCK002128 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:06:52 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57C36gS003482 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:03:06 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57C36Eg003480 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:03:06 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57C35gS003469 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:03:06 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 16342 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 12:02:48 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 16335 invoked by uid 509); 7 Jun 2003 12:02:47 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Sat Jun 07 12:02:47 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!feed.news.nacamar.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!194.168.4.91.MISMATCH!newspeer1-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail From: "William Manley" Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <963Ea.2254$0d7.62602@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> <3EE1185B.6080103@lehigh.edu> <20030607001849.GB3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <3EE133E7.7020507@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)gen X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Message-ID: <1skEa.2845$0d7.81794@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 12:59:02 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.2.179.21 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net 1054987133 80.2.179.21 (Sat, 07 Jun 2003 12:58:53 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 12:58:53 BST Organization: ntl Cablemodem News Service Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25652 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.5 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,PRIORITY_NO_NAME,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 546 Lines: 9 > > I don't know, I've been messing around with Doxygen for the past > few days, and although it's cool having the docs in the code, being > forced to comment everything and re-audit the code, I think the > output it produces pretty much sucks, IMO. They need some type of > template system, then it would be sweet. They have XML output --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Jun 07 14:28:22 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 14:28:22 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Oco2-0007Qs-00 for ; Sat, 07 Jun 2003 14:28:22 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57CSHCK002344 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:28:18 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57CSHgS005018 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:28:17 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57CSHPI005017 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:28:17 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57CSFgS005005 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:28:16 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 21051 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 12:28:02 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 21044 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 12:28:02 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:27:01 +0200 From: Arnout Engelen To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)gen Message-ID: <20030607122701.GC3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <963Ea.2254$0d7.62602@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> <3EE1185B.6080103@lehigh.edu> <20030607001849.GB3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <3EE133E7.7020507@earthlink.net> <1skEa.2845$0d7.81794@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1skEa.2845$0d7.81794@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Face: +5<4p=wAw9CfJeb1)}#72dL9Kz#0|wnyTLORn(~.;+B3?(:8HXkA^9yzF/aHD/p~Ge]GlYyLtI3+U<""hFLN3JH}}n= X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-33.4 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 829 Lines: 21 On Sat, Jun 07, 2003 at 12:59:02PM +0100, William Manley wrote: > > I don't know, I've been messing around with Doxygen for the past > > few days, and although it's cool having the docs in the code, being > > forced to comment everything and re-audit the code, I think the > > output it produces pretty much sucks, IMO. They need some type of > > template system, then it would be sweet. > They have XML output I turned it on for you to check out: http://www.bzzt.net/~wxwindows/doxygen/xml/ Haven't checked, but I'd guess they have some nice xslt stylesheets to turn it into other formats on the doxygen site. Arnout --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Jun 07 14:34:32 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 14:34:32 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Ocu0-0008Uo-00 for ; Sat, 07 Jun 2003 14:34:32 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57CYRCK002425 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:34:27 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57CYRgS005393 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:34:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57CYRlR005392 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:34:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57CYQgS005382 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:34:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 23007 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 12:34:12 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 23000 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 12:34:12 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:32:55 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[2]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)gen To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> In-Reply-To: <20030607001849.GB3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.5 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 1620 Lines: 45 On Sat, 7 Jun 2003 02:18:49 +0200 Arnout Engelen wrote: AE> Well. I did a small test run, put it up at: AE> AE> http://www.bzzt.net/~wxwindows/doxygen/html/ Good, thank you. This readily shows many problems with using doxygen (I don't say that they're unsolvable): 1. we have plenty of wxFooBase which shouldn't be there (but their methods should appear in wxFoo) 2. all macro-based stuff is not documented, of course, including the event table macro (well, they do appear in the list of globals but this is hardly helpful) 3. headers diagrams while *very* nice don't seem correct, unfortunately, at least I don't see any port/window.h files there, for example AE> - added '#ifndef DOC_DONT_EXTRACT' to: I *hate* this #ifndef. Didn't doxygen have "\internal" command to prevent something from appearing in the docs? AE> Eventually converting the existing documentation (it is a *lot*) to a AE> structured format (beit doxygen or xml) would be great, but I see AE> *many* problems there. I've added some more questions to http://wiki.wxwindows.org/wiki.pl?Using_Doxygen_For_The_WxWindows_Documentation BTW. AE> Challenging, though. Yes, it is. This is what I'm trying to convey from the very beginning of ths thread but unfortunately people seem to take it as a personal insult to doxygen -- which it is not. It's just a statement of fact. Thanks for your test, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Jun 07 18:46:52 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 18:46:52 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OgqB-0006JM-00 for ; Sat, 07 Jun 2003 18:46:51 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57Gklw0007123 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2003 18:46:47 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57GklgS022247 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 18:46:47 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57Gklr4022246 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 18:46:47 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57GkkgS022236 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 18:46:46 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 8327 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 16:46:32 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 8320 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 16:46:32 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 18:45:31 +0200 From: Arnout Engelen To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)gen Message-ID: <20030607164531.GE3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <20030607001849.GB3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Face: +5<4p=wAw9CfJeb1)}#72dL9Kz#0|wnyTLORn(~.;+B3?(:8HXkA^9yzF/aHD/p~Ge]GlYyLtI3+U<""hFLN3JH}}n= X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.9 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2214 Lines: 65 On Sat, Jun 07, 2003 at 02:32:55PM +0200, Vadim Zeitlin wrote: > On Sat, 7 Jun 2003 02:18:49 +0200 Arnout Engelen wrote: > > AE> Well. I did a small test run, put it up at: > AE> > AE> http://www.bzzt.net/~wxwindows/doxygen/html/ > > Good, thank you. This readily shows many problems with using doxygen (I > don't say that they're unsolvable): > > 1. we have plenty of wxFooBase which shouldn't be there (but their methods > should appear in wxFoo) I used the '/** @class wxFoo */ class wxFooBase' trick for a couple (like wxCaret). It doesn't seem to work yet, though (I miss 'wxCaret::Create' for example). > 2. all macro-based stuff is not documented, of course, including the event > table macro (well, they do appear in the list of globals but this is > hardly helpful) > 3. headers diagrams while *very* nice don't seem correct, unfortunately, > at least I don't see any port/window.h files there, for example that'd be because I didn't include any of the include/wx/port directories yet, I think :). Check if it's better now. > AE> - added '#ifndef DOC_DONT_EXTRACT' to: > > I *hate* this #ifndef. Didn't doxygen have "\internal" command to prevent > something from appearing in the docs? At first glance I believe that allows one to add comments that will only show up in the docs, not hide the class/member itself. Hiding the information we want to hide without the ifdefs [1] is going to be an interesting excercise, I think. [1] #ifdeffing whole classes would basically be fine with me, to be honest, but the following is clearly unacceptible: class wxFoo #ifndef DOC_DONT_EXTRACT : SomeParentClass #endif { .. } > AE> Eventually converting the existing documentation (it is a *lot*) to a > AE> structured format (beit doxygen or xml) would be great, but I see > AE> *many* problems there. > > I've added some more questions to > > http://wiki.wxwindows.org/wiki.pl?Using_Doxygen_For_The_WxWindows_Documentation thanks! Regards, Arnout --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Jun 07 19:00:30 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 19:00:30 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Oh3O-0006NE-00 for ; Sat, 07 Jun 2003 19:00:30 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57H0Pw0007355 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2003 19:00:25 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57H0PgS023153 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 19:00:25 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57H0PVv023152 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 19:00:25 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57H0OgS023142 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 19:00:24 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 11300 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 17:00:03 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 11291 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 17:00:03 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 18:58:46 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[2]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)gen To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <2003060 <20030607164531.GE3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> In-Reply-To: <20030607164531.GE3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2520 Lines: 64 On Sat, 7 Jun 2003 18:45:31 +0200 Arnout Engelen wrote: AE> I used the '/** @class wxFoo */ class wxFooBase' trick for a couple (like AE> wxCaret). It doesn't seem to work yet, though (I miss 'wxCaret::Create' AE> for example). I've also found some other occurences where it was even stranger: I've seen both wxFoo which was shown as derived from wxFooBase but not showing wxFooBase methods and wxBar which *was* showing wxBarBase methods but which wasn't shown as derived from wxBar. I don't remember the values of Foo and Bar but it shouldn't be difficult to find... AE> > 2. all macro-based stuff is not documented, of course, including the event AE> > table macro (well, they do appear in the list of globals but this is AE> > hardly helpful) We'd really need to do something about the event macros... AE> > 3. headers diagrams while *very* nice don't seem correct, unfortunately, AE> > at least I don't see any port/window.h files there, for example AE> AE> that'd be because I didn't include any of the include/wx/port AE> directories yet, I think :). Check if it's better now. Yes, it is. It would be interesting to see what happens when you include *all* files under include, of course... Thinking about it, it has no chance of working though -- how is doxygen supposed to know that it should document only the union of wxFooBase methods + the constructors of wxFoo for each port? No way, really :-( AE> > AE> - added '#ifndef DOC_DONT_EXTRACT' to: AE> > AE> > I *hate* this #ifndef. Didn't doxygen have "\internal" command to prevent AE> > something from appearing in the docs? AE> AE> At first glance I believe that allows one to add comments that will only AE> show up in the docs, not hide the class/member itself. Hiding the information AE> we want to hide without the ifdefs [1] is going to be an interesting AE> excercise, I think. We could ask for adding \no command to doxygen. Or some special "/** - ... */" comment... AE> [1] #ifdeffing whole classes would basically be fine with me, to be AE> honest, but the following is clearly unacceptible: AE> AE> class wxFoo AE> #ifndef DOC_DONT_EXTRACT AE> : SomeParentClass AE> #endif AE> { AE> .. AE> } As is using such #ifdef inside the class declaration -- probably several times. Regards, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Jun 07 17:18:54 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 17:18:54 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OfT4-00055d-00 for ; Sat, 07 Jun 2003 17:18:54 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57FInw0006098 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2003 17:18:50 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57FF4gS016369 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 17:15:04 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57FF4Zi016368 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 17:15:04 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57FF3gS016356 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 17:15:04 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 21438 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 15:14:49 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 21431 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 15:14:49 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EE202CE.60500@lehigh.edu> Date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 11:20:46 -0400 From: John Labenski Reply-To: jrl1@Lehigh.EDU User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.3.1) Gecko/20030428 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)gen References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <963Ea.2254$0d7.62602@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> <3EE1185B.6080103@lehigh.edu> <20030607001849.GB3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> In-Reply-To: <20030607001849.GB3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 2166 Lines: 57 Arnout Engelen wrote: > Well. I did a small test run, put it up at: > > http://www.bzzt.net/~wxwindows/doxygen/html/ Cool, is that semi-permenent? I really don't understand why some people got so bent out of shape, it's pretty useful as is. > based on configfile > http://www.bzzt.net/~wxwindows/doxygen/wxWindows/doxconfig EXTRACT_PRIVATE = NO INLINE_INHERITED_MEMB = NO ALPHABETICAL_INDEX = NO SOURCE_BROWSER = NO INLINE_SOURCES = NO If you turn these on it gets quite a bit more useful, the last two will make it significanty larger, but very powerful. I especially like the links in the source code and see that in itself (well maybe the neat diagrams too) as it's greatest feature. It might even put Vadim out of a job! :) (the one where he answers questions easily found by a quick look into the source code) I wonder what would happen with the gtk/msw/mac/univ versions with the source browser, perhaps it'd just gag? Perhaps you'd have to make different versions? Maybe turning this on could help in differentiating them. FULL_PATH_NAMES = NO I've just tried doxygen on a program of mine with all the source and headers in one dir, nothing this complicated. > I see not all public functions of the wxMBConv class are shown. I wonder > why. That is odd, I can understand the #ifdef wxUSE_UNICODE causing problems, but not the other two. Oh well, doxygen is fairly young right? > Note that I'm not a doxygen-groupy that does this to push doxygen, > rather I still think doxygen might be promising and it'd be fun to try > it out, while helping the discussion focus. Eventually converting the > existing documentation (it is a *lot*) to a structured format (beit > doxygen or xml) would be great, but I see *many* problems there. > Challenging, though. Sure, I don't see any reason to try to rush headlong into it, but I also don't see any reason not to use it as is. Thanks, -John Labenski --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Jun 07 18:37:25 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 18:37:25 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Ogh3-0006H4-00 for ; Sat, 07 Jun 2003 18:37:25 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57GbLw0007028 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2003 18:37:21 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57GbLgS021754 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 18:37:21 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57GbK81021753 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 18:37:20 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57GbKgS021743 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 18:37:20 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 6276 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 16:37:05 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 6269 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 16:37:04 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 18:36:03 +0200 From: Arnout Engelen To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org, jrl1@Lehigh.EDU Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever)gen Message-ID: <20030607163603.GD3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <963Ea.2254$0d7.62602@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> <3EE1185B.6080103@lehigh.edu> <20030607001849.GB3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> <3EE202CE.60500@lehigh.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3EE202CE.60500@lehigh.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Face: +5<4p=wAw9CfJeb1)}#72dL9Kz#0|wnyTLORn(~.;+B3?(:8HXkA^9yzF/aHD/p~Ge]GlYyLtI3+U<""hFLN3JH}}n= X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.9 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2228 Lines: 64 On Sat, Jun 07, 2003 at 11:20:46AM -0400, John Labenski wrote: > Arnout Engelen wrote: > >Well. I did a small test run, put it up at: > > > > http://www.bzzt.net/~wxwindows/doxygen/html/ > > Cool, is that semi-permenent? sure > >based on configfile > > http://www.bzzt.net/~wxwindows/doxygen/wxWindows/doxconfig > > EXTRACT_PRIVATE = NO > INLINE_INHERITED_MEMB = NO > ALPHABETICAL_INDEX = NO > SOURCE_BROWSER = NO > INLINE_SOURCES = NO > > If you turn these on it gets quite a bit more useful changed those > I wonder what would happen with the gtk/msw/mac/univ versions with the > source browser, perhaps it'd just gag? Perhaps you'd have to make > different versions? Hmm. I wondered about that. Initially I included only 'include/wx', but I noticed some stuff was missing. So now I decided to add /gtk, too, as a hack. What would be the best way to do this? doxygen experts anywhere? :) > Maybe turning this on could help in differentiating them. > FULL_PATH_NAMES = NO from the docs: If the FULL_PATH_NAMES tag is set to YES doxygen will prepend the full path before files name in the file list and in the header files. If set to NO the shortest path that makes the file name unique will be used shouldn't be a problem, thus, i guess? > >I see not all public functions of the wxMBConv class are shown. I wonder > >why. > > That is odd, I can understand the #ifdef wxUSE_UNICODE causing problems, > but not the other two. Oh well, doxygen is fairly young right? well, of course this needs fixing. on the upside, though, it feels more justifiable to fix a bug in doxygen than it does fixing one in tex2rtf (or any wxwindows-specific set of scripts), since many more people will benefit from a fix in doxygen. Thanks for your initial incentive to get this started, and this feedback. It should be interesting to see how far we can get using and maybe extending doxygen to fit the needs of a large, complicated set like wxwindows. Regards, Arnout --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 06 17:59:56 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 17:59:56 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OJdE-0001gf-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 17:59:56 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h56FxqLs008543 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:59:52 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h56Fu7gS013121 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:56:07 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h56Fu76E013120 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:56:07 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h56Fu5gS013107 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 17:56:06 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 578 invoked by uid 43863); 6 Jun 2003 15:55:09 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 567 invoked from network); 6 Jun 2003 15:55:08 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2003 08:53:22 -0700 Subject: Re: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Kevin Ollivier To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <000EDA62-9837-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-21.0 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 6876 Lines: 173 On Friday, June 6, 2003, at 01:47 PM, Jos=E9 Fonseca wrote: > > In article <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl>, Arnout Engelen = =20 > wrote: >> On Fri, Jun 06, 2003 at 02:42:18AM +0000, Jos? Fonseca wrote: >>> >>> In article , David =20= >>> Elliott wrote: >>>> First of all, this topic has been discussed to death several times =20= >>>> in >>>> the past. >>> >>> I guessed that much but I was arrogant enough to think my input = could >>> add some value to the dicussion. >> >> In response to another message saying 'this has been discusses at =20 >> length >> before', I created the following summary: >> >> =20 >> http://wiki.wxwindows.org/=20 >> wiki.pl?Using_Doxygen_For_The_WxWindows_Documentation >> > > Interesting. > >> My own impression, after reading previous threads on the issue, is >> that it'd be generally agreed to be a nice idea to have documentation >> generated by doxygen, but there are practical issues that might make >> this unfeasible. I believe *all* of the 'but Doxygen can't do ...' >> statements have since moved from 'outstanding issues' to 'solved >> issues', to the point that 'outstanding issues' is now empty. > > Even most of the cons there focus Doxygen formatting or implementation > issues. The real arguments there against using documentation > extractions in general are (in decreasing importance): > > - it's a *lot* of work > - the source gets 'cluttered' > - it becomes increasingly difficult for a non-developer to modify it > > That last third argument has really no ground, and even if it had, > according to David it's the developers who write, and it's always one > less window open. > > Regarding the second, I know of some poeple who feel the same for = _any_ > kind of comment, but it's always subjective. The ammount of > documentation seen for example in > http://www.wxwindows.org/manuals/2.4.0/wx46.htm#wxbutton would still = be > little compared with the surrounding code. > > The first is effectively concerning, and gets more as time goes by. =20= > Some > scripts can be written to help this, or [non-developer] volunteers can > do the grunt of the work, but in the end it's a matter of = cost/benefit. > > Sadly it seems clear that most people here don't see any benefit in > having the docs in the source. I quite frankly don't know of any = other > project which tries to sync the docs with the source wihout actually > generating the former from the latter, and it seems quite an unnatural > thing to do. Most projects seem to actually be moving on the opposite > direction and even languages (e.g. Python) seem to move in the =20 > direction > of literate programming, with direct support for documentation. This = is > why I think this move will cause latter regret. I actually don't see why whether or not the docs are "in the source" =20 should even be an important factor, particularly the primary factor, to =20= use when deciding on a documentation tool. I think it comes from a mistaken perception that putting the docs in =20 the source leads to the 'autogeneration' of documentation, and thus =20 less work for developers. It doesn't. The only thing Doxygen really =20 does (without human intervention) is give a printout of all the =20 functions and variables used in a program. This is not documentation. =20= Documentation comes when the developer actually sits down and writes =20 human-readable comments about the functions and parameters in the code. =20= I think most people are no more or less likely to write this =20 documentation if it is in the code than if it is not. Why? Because there are two types of documentation: internal =20 implementation notes, which are indeed often written in the code while =20= the code is being written (not really for public use anyways), and =20 public documentation, which is usually written after a function or =20 class has been implemented and tested. Writing public documentation at =20= the same time you're writing the implementation code often doesn't make =20= sense, because you need to first test the code and make any necessary =20= API and implementation changes before writing such documentation. I don't know of any other project either that tries to do what we're =20 proposing, but quite frankly I know of a LOT of open source projects, =20= including some using doxygen, that have what I would consider to be =20 sub-standard project/API documentation. If the answer was simply 'use =20= Doxygen', I think you'd see well-documented projects popping up left =20 and right. Also, I wonder how much that documentation would improve if =20= they had to update the docs before they could compile them, like that =20= script we were writing to 're-invent the wheel' would require. =3D) I =20= myself find this very appealing, because I admittedly drag my feet when =20= writing documentation (the real cause of poor documentation!), but this =20= feature would force me to spend time on it, and that would be a very =20 good thing. Literate programming is really just a way to try and make documentation =20= more appealing to developers, as are tools like doxygen. They do little =20= to make the task of documentation simpler that I've seen, except maybe =20= to save a small amount of typing (function names and parameters) and to =20= make it seem more like writing code. =3D) Good documentation will always = =20 need to be hand-written regardless of the tool or language used. And, BTW, my sticking point on using doxygen is none of the three above =20= points you listed, although I do feel it makes the source code =20 cluttered and messy. My sticking point is that Doxygen was created for =20= simple source code documentation, whereas the wxWindows documentation =20= has topic overviews and other important sections of the documentation =20= which it would be unnatural to use Doxygen for. If you're already using =20= another tool for maintaining *some* of the documentation, why not be =20 consistent throughout? Having two tools means learning two sets of =20 syntax, having to somehow get them to look consistent and integrate =20 with each other, and supporting the same output formats. I don't see =20 this as being anywhere near trivial. Especially when you consider that =20= the documentation that is there could someday go to a print format. In short, I just haven't found out yet what makes Doxygen so special =20 that it's worth the effort. Formatting and implementation issues are =20 the core issues when choosing a documentation format, IMHO, not whether =20= or not it is in the source code. Thanks, Kevin --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Jun 07 19:47:22 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 19:47:22 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Ohmk-0006WO-00 for ; Sat, 07 Jun 2003 19:47:22 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57HlHw0007796 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2003 19:47:18 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57HhWgS025430 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 19:43:32 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57HhWhp025429 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 19:43:32 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57HhWgS025419 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 19:43:32 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 18484 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 17:43:18 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 18477 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 17:43:17 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030606215113.046b8550@pop.xs4all.nl> X-Sender: dimitri@pop.shortcut.nl (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 22:05:18 +0200 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org From: Dimitri Subject: Re: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) In-Reply-To: <000EDA62-9837-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1664 Lines: 37 At 17:53 6/6/2003, Kevin Ollivier wrote: >Literate programming is really just a way to try and make documentation >more appealing to developers, as are tools like doxygen. They do little >to make the task of documentation simpler that I've seen, except maybe What it can do though is automatically include all functions/classes/macros even if undocumented (Also optionally warn when something is undocumented). Sure you can always look in the headers but then there are some that consider that dirty (??) or even don't think to do that. >And, BTW, my sticking point on using doxygen is none of the three above >points you listed, although I do feel it makes the source code >cluttered and messy. My sticking point is that Doxygen was created for You don't have to have the documentation in the source code (But then one could scrap that of the 'pro Doxygen' list). >In short, I just haven't found out yet what makes Doxygen so special >that it's worth the effort. Formatting and implementation issues are >the core issues when choosing a documentation format, IMHO, not whether >or not it is in the source code. Personally, I find the syntax of doxygen easier than latex (I have very little experience with both). I have modified the wxWindows docs a couple of times and always was happy when I only needed to add some plain text. As soon as 'tags' (even just copy-catting ofcourse) were involved I would start sweating out of fear ;) Regards, Dimitri --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 00:32:51 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 00:32:51 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OmF1-0007yj-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 00:32:51 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57MWhw6010900 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 00:32:46 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57Ic0gS028858 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 20:38:00 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57Ic0qA028857 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 20:38:00 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57IbwgS028847 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 20:37:59 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 27698 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 18:37:42 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 27691 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 18:37:42 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 11:35:52 -0700 Subject: Re: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Kevin Ollivier To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030606215113.046b8550@pop.xs4all.nl> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 4467 Lines: 94 On Friday, June 6, 2003, at 01:05 PM, Dimitri wrote: > At 17:53 6/6/2003, Kevin Ollivier wrote: > >> Literate programming is really just a way to try and make >> documentation >> more appealing to developers, as are tools like doxygen. They do >> little >> to make the task of documentation simpler that I've seen, except maybe > > What it can do though is automatically include all > functions/classes/macros > even if undocumented (Also optionally warn when something is > undocumented). > Sure you can always look in the headers but then there are some that > consider > that dirty (??) or even don't think to do that. Yes, but in the end whenever a function or class isn't documented, the source code itself is the best documentation by far. I generally find I look at headers first, but almost invariably end up exploring the cpp files to find what a given function or class does. (Unless I already know the function exists and just need a name.) What would REALLY be cool (IMHO) is a source code browser/searcher, like the one used on the Mozilla web site. Most people would find the ability to search the tree for any keyword/class or functionname/etc. to be useful and non-intimidating, I think. =) Those that really fear looking into the sources, IMHO are generally also likely to get nervous about using an undocumented class in the first place. For those that don't think to check the sources, well, they may be just as likely to not consult the documentation at all and just head straight to the mailing list. ^_- >> And, BTW, my sticking point on using doxygen is none of the three >> above >> points you listed, although I do feel it makes the source code >> cluttered and messy. My sticking point is that Doxygen was created for > > You don't have to have the documentation in the source code (But then > one could scrap that of the 'pro Doxygen' list). Interesting, but then it becomes enough like the current LaTeX-based solution that I'm not sure its worth switching (unless the markup was significantly more flexible). The bottom line being that Doxygen wasn't really designed for writing things like manuals, and so its capabilities in that regard will always be somewhat limited. (Unless the wxWindows folks go through and extend it, but we're trying to get away from this sort of thing in the first place!) >> In short, I just haven't found out yet what makes Doxygen so special >> that it's worth the effort. Formatting and implementation issues are >> the core issues when choosing a documentation format, IMHO, not >> whether >> or not it is in the source code. > > Personally, I find the syntax of doxygen easier than latex (I have very > little experience with both). I have modified the wxWindows docs a > couple > of times and always was happy when I only needed to add some plain > text. > As soon as 'tags' (even just copy-catting ofcourse) were involved I > would start sweating out of fear ;) This is the tough part of a decision like this. The whole tags vs. 'plain text markup' issue really is a matter of preference, and preference is determined either by what looks less intimidating or what one has experience with. Aside from my own experience with and preference for *ML formats, the main reason for my like of XML (despite its admittedly more verbose syntax) is that it is easily parsed, and that tends to increase the number of tools available to developers for parsing and editing the format. Personally, if someone were to show a LaTeX toolset that could do everything the wxWindows developers have asked for (and also allow for wxPort specific docs, my personal hope for all this!) and a feasible way to put it together, I would say let's go with LaTeX, with the caveat that I don't know how long into the future the language is going to be well-supported. One cool tool in this regards is pyLaTeX (http://pylatex.sourceforge.net/), which parses the LaTeX file into a series of Python objects and lets you write converters. This may really simplify the logic of writing converters, or at least a LaTeX->DocBook converter. =) (I've played with a couple converters, but they choke with syntax errors, and I haven't figured out why it's choking yet.) Thanks, Kevin --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 00:32:51 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 00:32:51 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OmF1-0007yi-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 00:32:51 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57MWhwA010900 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 00:32:48 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57JEbgS001436 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 21:14:37 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57JEbPj001435 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 21:14:37 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57JEagS001425 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 21:14:36 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 6000 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 19:14:23 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 5992 invoked by uid 509); 7 Jun 2003 19:14:23 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Sat Jun 07 19:14:23 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!feed.news.nacamar.de!newsfeed.stueberl.de!newspeer1-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!newsfep4-winn.server.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail From: Jose Fonseca Subject: Re: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) User-Agent: Pan/0.14.0 (I'm Being Nibbled to Death by Cats!) Message-ID: Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030606215113.046b8550@pop.xs4all.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 20:12:57 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 81.101.208.10 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: newsfep4-winn.server.ntli.net 1055013234 81.101.208.10 (Sat, 07 Jun 2003 20:13:54 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 20:13:54 BST Organization: ntl Cablemodem News Service Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25666 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h57MWhwA010900 Status: RO Content-Length: 1025 Lines: 16 On Sat, 07 Jun 2003 18:37:49 +0000, Kevin Ollivier wrote: > > One cool tool in this regards is pyLaTeX=20 > (http://pylatex.sourceforge.net/), which parses the LaTeX file into a=20 > series of Python objects and lets you write converters. This may really= =20 > simplify the logic of writing converters, or at least a LaTeX->DocBook=20 > converter. =3D) (I've played with a couple converters, but they choke=20 > with syntax errors, and I haven't figured out why it's choking yet.) Didn't knew about this tool, thanks. It really seems a promising project,= not only because it's written in Python ;-), but because it uses that document object module which is the only sane way of writing robust converters. I might consider using it for generating HTML help for some software which has docs in latex. Jos=E9 Fonseca --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 01:26:01 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 01:26:01 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19On4T-0000ZX-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 01:26:01 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57NPvw0015501 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:25:57 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57NMCgS015610 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:22:12 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57NMCRu015609 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:22:12 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57NMBgS015599 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:22:11 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 15897 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 23:21:55 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 15890 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 23:21:55 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:20:54 +0200 From: Arnout Engelen To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Message-ID: <20030607232054.GF3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030606215113.046b8550@pop.xs4all.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Face: +5<4p=wAw9CfJeb1)}#72dL9Kz#0|wnyTLORn(~.;+B3?(:8HXkA^9yzF/aHD/p~Ge]GlYyLtI3+U<""hFLN3JH}}n= X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.9 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1465 Lines: 36 On Sat, Jun 07, 2003 at 11:35:52AM -0700, Kevin Ollivier wrote: > On Friday, June 6, 2003, at 01:05 PM, Dimitri wrote: > >At 17:53 6/6/2003, Kevin Ollivier wrote: > > Interesting, but then it becomes enough like the current LaTeX-based > solution that I'm not sure its worth switching (unless the markup was > significantly more flexible). The problem with the current docs is, in my humble opinion, that tough maybe flexible, they certainly are not structured. There is no way to automatically extract information from them, since they are not in a consistant parsable format. To give an example: the bot in #wxwindows (freenode, irc) has some functionality, so you can ask it what parents a certain class has, or what arguments a certain method of a class takes and what it's documentation says. This works 'most of the time', since the information is not formally structured. It just looks at the html documentation and makes some assumptions and guesses about the format that hold most but not all of the time. If the docs were available in a structured way (the format is less relevant, but XML seems an obvious choice, or even more ambitiously doxygen-generating-XML), this kind of applications could be implemented properly. Regards, Arnout --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 01:49:04 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 01:49:04 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OnQm-0001VE-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 01:49:04 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57Nn0w0015738 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:49:00 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57NmxgS016555 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:49:00 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57NmxTi016554 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:48:59 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57NmxgS016544 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:48:59 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 21761 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 23:48:47 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 21754 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 23:48:47 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 19:48:42 -0400 Subject: Re: Re[8]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: David Elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030607232054.GF3523@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Message-Id: <91E2E16E-9942-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1207 Lines: 28 On Saturday, June 7, 2003, at 07:20 PM, Arnout Engelen wrote: > On Sat, Jun 07, 2003 at 11:35:52AM -0700, Kevin Ollivier wrote: >> On Friday, June 6, 2003, at 01:05 PM, Dimitri wrote: >>> At 17:53 6/6/2003, Kevin Ollivier wrote: >> >> Interesting, but then it becomes enough like the current LaTeX-based >> solution that I'm not sure its worth switching (unless the markup was >> significantly more flexible). > > The problem with the current docs is, in my humble opinion, that tough > maybe flexible, they certainly are not structured. There is no way to > automatically extract information from them, since they are not in a > consistant parsable format. > Huh? As far as I can tell, Tex is a consistently parsable format. Certainly not the best, but it's not as bad as you make it out to be. However, the manual/reference as it is isn't really designed to do this kind of stuff, that's really a job for something like Doxygen-- more on that in a future reply to an earlier message. -Dave --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Jun 06 18:43:54 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 06 Jun 2003 18:43:54 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OKJm-0001pb-00 for ; Fri, 06 Jun 2003 18:43:54 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h56GhoLs009671 for ; Fri, 6 Jun 2003 18:43:50 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h56GhngS019137 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 18:43:49 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h56GhnRQ019135 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 18:43:49 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h56GhngS019125 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 6 Jun 2003 18:43:49 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 21410 invoked by uid 43863); 6 Jun 2003 16:43:28 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 21403 invoked by uid 509); 6 Jun 2003 16:43:28 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Fri Jun 06 16:43:28 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!newsfeed1.uni2.dk!uio.no!newsfeed.vmunix.org!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!dclient80-218-107-102.hispeed.CH!not-for-mail From: otto.wyss@bluewin.ch (Otto Wyss) Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2003 18:41:56 +0200 Message-ID: <1fw59f7.du0oetv5f0puN%otto.wyss@bluewin.ch> References: <20030606080553.GM18630@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> NNTP-Posting-Host: dclient80-218-107-102.hispeed.ch (80.218.107.102) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1054917716 13204129 80.218.107.102 (16 [23565]) X-Orig-Path: otto.wyss User-Agent: MacSOUP/D-2.4.6 Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25616 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h56GhoLs009671 Status: RO Content-Length: 1153 Lines: 25 Jos=E9 Fonseca wrote: I've followed this subject not only because of wxWindows' docs but also in my own project. > Sadly it seems clear that most people here don't see any benefit in > having the docs in the source. I quite frankly don't know of any other >=20 Since I started a new project I thought it would be easy to integrate the docs into the code. But soon I discovered in my case it doesn't make much sense. The reason are: - the docs would be very uneven distributed in my code - where there is much docs the code gets unreadable - some docs is completely unrelated to code IMO docs within code is only useful if there is a 1:1 relation and I haven't found a solution to mix docs within code with oder docs. Instead of integrating docs within the code I'd prefer a solution where code and docs were linked together. O. Wyss --=20 See =7F"http://wxguide.sourceforge.net/" for ideas how to design your app. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Jun 07 14:41:23 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 14:41:23 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Od0d-0000GA-00 for ; Sat, 07 Jun 2003 14:41:23 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57CfJCK002530 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:41:19 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57CbYgS005603 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:37:34 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57CbYn7005602 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:37:34 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57CbXgS005592 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:37:33 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 24278 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 12:37:19 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 24268 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 12:37:19 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 14:36:03 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[10]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <15EFDFD7-93C7-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h57CfJCK002530 Status: RO Content-Length: 2178 Lines: 59 On Tue, 03 Jun 2003 13:26:47 GMT Jos=E9 Fonseca = wrote: JF> - You're writing techinal reference documentation. Not a book about JF> wxWindows. No, we're writing a combination of both. If we could separate the docs i= n the "manual" and "reference" part, it would be different. We can't becaus= e we don't have enough time to maintain both and also because it is going t= o be far more complicated. JF> - Flexibility isn't everything. There's nothing more flexible than JF> writing by hand in all the desired formats(!), but something tells = me JF> than nobody wants to spend the rest of their lifes writing docs. I don't care about output formats, I think that doxygen can produce all = of them. I care about the flexibility of the docs structure, e.g. I don't kn= ow how to automatically put a "Events" section in all classes docs using doxygen. JF> - Formats _do_ change, but a computer language (such as C++) is here = for JF> quite some time and will stay for much longer (probably even more t= han JF> the XML formats such as DocBook, and at least as long as wxWindows JF> uses it). If in ten years from now you don't want to change your JF> documentation to the format of the day you should take advantage of JF> that. A tool such as Doxygen can be easily be extended to new JF> formats, and probably already will handle in ten years the formats = of JF> then. Irrelevent. It applies just as much to tex2rtf. JF> - Again on flexibility, a open-source tool such as Doxygen, allows JF> anybody to modify to suit their specific needs. Although this isn'= t JF> excuse for everything, it gives you your such acclaimed flexibility= , JF> in case you actually need it. Do you have any idea about how to modify Doxygen to do what I asked for above? I surely don't. JF> seperate what you have in a User Manual and a Reference Manual. Who is going to spend twice as much time maintaining both of them? VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 00:32:54 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 00:32:54 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OmF4-0007yz-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 00:32:54 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57MWhwC010900 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 00:32:49 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57IxXgS000287 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 20:59:33 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57IxX8p000286 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 20:59:33 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57IxXgS000274 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 7 Jun 2003 20:59:33 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 2833 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 18:59:19 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 2826 invoked by uid 509); 7 Jun 2003 18:59:19 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Sat Jun 07 18:59:19 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!feed.news.nacamar.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!194.168.4.91.MISMATCH!newspeer1-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9?= Fonseca Subject: Re: Re[10]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) References: <15EFDFD7-93C7-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 User-Agent: slrn/0.9.7.4 (Linux) Message-ID: <8AqEa.3079$0d7.89727@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> Date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 18:57:08 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 81.101.208.10 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net 1055012228 81.101.208.10 (Sat, 07 Jun 2003 19:57:08 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 07 Jun 2003 19:57:08 BST Organization: ntl Cablemodem News Service Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25665 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.8 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h57MWhwC010900 Status: RO Content-Length: 5226 Lines: 123 In article , Vadim Zeitlin wrote: > On Tue, 03 Jun 2003 13:26:47 GMT Jos=E9 Fonseca > wrote: >=20 > > - You're writing techinal reference documentation. Not a book about > > wxWindows. >=20 > No, we're writing a combination of both. If we could separate the > docs in the "manual" and "reference" part, it would be different. We > can't because we don't have enough time to maintain both and also > because it is going to be far more complicated. >=20 > > - Flexibility isn't everything. There's nothing more flexible than > > writing by hand in all the desired formats(!), but something tells > > me than nobody wants to spend the rest of their lifes writing docs. >=20 > I don't care about output formats, I think that doxygen can produce > all of them. I care about the flexibility of the docs structure, e.g. > I don't know how to automatically put a "Events" section in all > classes docs using doxygen. >=20 > > - Formats _do_ change, but a computer language (such as C++) is here > > for quite some time and will stay for much longer (probably even > > more than the XML formats such as DocBook, and at least as long as > > wxWindows uses it). If in ten years from now you don't want to > > change your documentation to the format of the day you should take > > advantage of that. A tool such as Doxygen can be easily be extended > > to new formats, and probably already will handle in ten years the > > formats of then. >=20 > Irrelevent. It applies just as much to tex2rtf. >=20 > > - Again on flexibility, a open-source tool such as Doxygen, allows > > anybody to modify to suit their specific needs. Although this isn't > > excuse for everything, it gives you your such acclaimed flexibility, > > in case you actually need it. >=20 > Do you have any idea about how to modify Doxygen to do what I asked > for above? I surely don't. I really don't exactly in what way you want to modify it.=20 Do you want to Doxygen to extract the events from the source somehow? If so then I can't tell you - I'm not a Doxygen maintainer. Try Ask in one of their lists if you really want an answer. It shouldn't be more difficult to modify than with any other other tool and easier than pull off your own script. If you just want to know how to write a event table see an example below. > > seperate what you have in a User Manual and a Reference Manual. >=20 > Who is going to spend twice as much time maintaining both of them? You must be joking, right? Since when breaking a complex problem in n-pieces takes as much as n-times the time it took to solve originally?=20 You wouldn't need to duplicate the information in the reference manual in the user manual. You would merely cover the broad and loosely formated sections in the user manual, e.g., introductions, small tutorials, special topics, i.e., the "Introduction", "Multi-platform development with wxWindows", "Topic Overviews" and of the current documentation. Note that this user/reference manuals division is a successful recipe applied in most technical documentation. It's not only interesting from reader practical point of view, but also from the writer, since they have truly very different ways of creating, being the latter [the reference manual] very akin to be fully/partial generated from the sources. As a proof of concept I've moved the wxButton latex documentation into doxygen comments. The doxygen configuration file was based on Arnout's but tweaked and updated to the latest version: http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/Doxyfile The resulting output is: http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/html/classwxButton.html http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/html/button_8h.html Compare it with the original: http://www.wxwindows.org/manuals/2.4.0/wx46.htm#wxbutton Obviously there are differences but the bulk is there. Now take a look to the source code: http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/include/wx/button.h And compare it with the latex source: http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/docs/latex/wx/button.tex Which one is easier to write and maintain? Can anybody with a honest face tell me that the source is cluttered, or that flexibility was lost? Yes, takes time to convert, but only if there is strong sign from the wxWindows maintainers to change that volunteers can be mobilized, aiding scripts can be written, and the corner cases can be taken care of. I think that it's the lack of familiarity with Doxygen which is preventing the people who can make the decision from properly avaliate the advantages/disadvantages of doing so, spite of the enourmous internal/external community support around Doxygen. No need to contradict me - this is my final argument anyway. If this doesn't convince the ceptics then nothing I say or do will ever do, and spite I'm very found of wxWindows I can't waste more time and energy arguing on this issue. Jos=E9 Fonseca PS: These links aren't permanent and in a couple of days I'll take them down. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 10:56:07 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 10:56:07 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OvyA-0003GV-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 10:56:06 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h588u0FK026914 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 10:56:01 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h588u0gS003791 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 10:56:00 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h588u0p0003790 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 10:56:00 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h588txgS003777 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 10:55:59 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 21069 invoked by uid 43863); 8 Jun 2003 08:55:38 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 21062 invoked from network); 8 Jun 2003 08:55:38 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 09:55:23 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-15?Q?Jos=E9?= Fonseca To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Message-ID: <20030608085523.GA13533@prometeu> References: <15EFDFD7-93C7-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> <8AqEa.3079$0d7.89727@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Security: MIME headers sanitized on wn1 See http://www.impsec.org/email-tools/sanitizer-intro.html for details. $Revision: 1.136 $Date: 2002-10-20 10:38:14-07 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="ibTvN161/egqYuK8" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <8AqEa.3079$0d7.89727@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.9 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,HTML_00_10,HTML_MESSAGE,IN_REP_TO, KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,PATCH_UNIFIED_DIFF,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 60080 Lines: 1499 --ibTvN161/egqYuK8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-15 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h588u0FK026914 On Sat, Jun 07, 2003 at 06:57:08PM +0000, Jos=E9 Fonseca wrote: > As a proof of concept I've moved the wxButton latex documentation into > doxygen comments. The doxygen configuration file was based on Arnout's > but tweaked and updated to the latest version: >=20 > http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/Doxyfile >=20 > The resulting output is: >=20 > http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/html/classwxButton.html > http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/html/button_8h.html >=20 > Compare it with the original: >=20 > http://www.wxwindows.org/manuals/2.4.0/wx46.htm#wxbutton >=20 > Obviously there are differences but the bulk is there. >=20 >=20 > Now take a look to the source code: >=20 > http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/include/wx/button.h >=20 > And compare it with the latex source: >=20 > http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/docs/latex/wx/button.tex >=20 >=20 > Which one is easier to write and maintain? Can anybody with a honest > face tell me that the source is cluttered, or that flexibility was lost= ? > Yes, takes time to convert, but only if there is strong sign from the > wxWindows maintainers to change that volunteers can be mobilized, aidin= g > scripts can be written, and the corner cases can be taken care of. I > think that it's the lack of familiarity with Doxygen which is preventin= g > the people who can make the decision from properly avaliate the > advantages/disadvantages of doing so, spite of the enourmous > internal/external community support around Doxygen. >=20 >=20 > No need to contradict me - this is my final argument anyway. If this > doesn't convince the ceptics then nothing I say or do will ever do, and > spite I'm very found of wxWindows I can't waste more time and energy > arguing on this issue. Too bad it didn't. Attached is the patch in case someone ever wants to go trhough with it. Jos=E9 Fonseca --ibTvN161/egqYuK8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="wxButton-Doxygen.diff" diff -urN wxWindows-2.4.0.orig/Doxyfile wxWindows-2.4.0/Doxyfile --- wxWindows-2.4.0.orig/Doxyfile 1970-01-01 01:00:00.000000000 +0100 +++ wxWindows-2.4.0/Doxyfile 2003-06-07 19:18:33.000000000 +0100 @@ -0,0 +1,1054 @@ +# Doxyfile 1.3-rc3 + +# This file describes the settings to be used by the documentation system +# doxygen (www.doxygen.org) for a project +# +# All text after a hash (#) is considered a comment and will be ignored +# The format is: +# TAG = value [value, ...] +# For lists items can also be appended using: +# TAG += value [value, ...] +# Values that contain spaces should be placed between quotes (" ") + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# General configuration options +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# The PROJECT_NAME tag is a single word (or a sequence of words surrounded +# by quotes) that should identify the project. + +PROJECT_NAME = wxWindows + +# The PROJECT_NUMBER tag can be used to enter a project or revision number. +# This could be handy for archiving the generated documentation or +# if some version control system is used. + +PROJECT_NUMBER = 2.4.0 + +# The OUTPUT_DIRECTORY tag is used to specify the (relative or absolute) +# base path where the generated documentation will be put. +# If a relative path is entered, it will be relative to the location +# where doxygen was started. If left blank the current directory will be used. + +OUTPUT_DIRECTORY = + +# The OUTPUT_LANGUAGE tag is used to specify the language in which all +# documentation generated by doxygen is written. Doxygen will use this +# information to generate all constant output in the proper language. +# The default language is English, other supported languages are: +# Brazilian, Catalan, Chinese, Chinese-Traditional, Croatian, Czech, Danish, Dutch, +# Finnish, French, German, Greek, Hungarian, Italian, Japanese, Japanese-en +# (Japanese with english messages), Korean, Norwegian, Polish, Portuguese, +# Romanian, Russian, Serbian, Slovak, Slovene, Spanish, Swedish and Ukrainian. + +OUTPUT_LANGUAGE = English + +# If the EXTRACT_ALL tag is set to YES doxygen will assume all entities in +# documentation are documented, even if no documentation was available. +# Private class members and static file members will be hidden unless +# the EXTRACT_PRIVATE and EXTRACT_STATIC tags are set to YES + +EXTRACT_ALL = YES + +# If the EXTRACT_PRIVATE tag is set to YES all private members of a class +# will be included in the documentation. + +EXTRACT_PRIVATE = NO + +# If the EXTRACT_STATIC tag is set to YES all static members of a file +# will be included in the documentation. + +EXTRACT_STATIC = NO + +# If the EXTRACT_LOCAL_CLASSES tag is set to YES classes (and structs) +# defined locally in source files will be included in the documentation. +# If set to NO only classes defined in header files are included. + +EXTRACT_LOCAL_CLASSES = YES + +# If the HIDE_UNDOC_MEMBERS tag is set to YES, Doxygen will hide all +# undocumented members of documented classes, files or namespaces. +# If set to NO (the default) these members will be included in the +# various overviews, but no documentation section is generated. +# This option has no effect if EXTRACT_ALL is enabled. + +HIDE_UNDOC_MEMBERS = NO + +# If the HIDE_UNDOC_CLASSES tag is set to YES, Doxygen will hide all +# undocumented classes that are normally visible in the class hierarchy. +# If set to NO (the default) these class will be included in the various +# overviews. This option has no effect if EXTRACT_ALL is enabled. + +HIDE_UNDOC_CLASSES = NO + +# If the HIDE_FRIEND_COMPOUNDS tag is set to YES, Doxygen will hide all +# friend (class|struct|union) declarations. +# If set to NO (the default) these declarations will be included in the +# documentation. + +HIDE_FRIEND_COMPOUNDS = NO + +# If the HIDE_IN_BODY_DOCS tag is set to YES, Doxygen will hide any +# documentation blocks found inside the body of a function. +# If set to NO (the default) these blocks will be appended to the +# function's detailed documentation block. + +HIDE_IN_BODY_DOCS = NO + +# If the BRIEF_MEMBER_DESC tag is set to YES (the default) Doxygen will +# include brief member descriptions after the members that are listed in +# the file and class documentation (similar to JavaDoc). +# Set to NO to disable this. + +BRIEF_MEMBER_DESC = YES + +# If the REPEAT_BRIEF tag is set to YES (the default) Doxygen will prepend +# the brief description of a member or function before the detailed description. +# Note: if both HIDE_UNDOC_MEMBERS and BRIEF_MEMBER_DESC are set to NO, the +# brief descriptions will be completely suppressed. + +REPEAT_BRIEF = YES + +# If the ALWAYS_DETAILED_SEC and REPEAT_BRIEF tags are both set to YES then +# Doxygen will generate a detailed section even if there is only a brief +# description. + +ALWAYS_DETAILED_SEC = NO + +# If the INLINE_INHERITED_MEMB tag is set to YES, doxygen will show all inherited +# members of a class in the documentation of that class as if those members were +# ordinary class members. Constructors, destructors and assignment operators of +# the base classes will not be shown. + +INLINE_INHERITED_MEMB = YES + +# If the FULL_PATH_NAMES tag is set to YES then Doxygen will prepend the full +# path before files name in the file list and in the header files. If set +# to NO the shortest path that makes the file name unique will be used. + +FULL_PATH_NAMES = NO + +# If the FULL_PATH_NAMES tag is set to YES then the STRIP_FROM_PATH tag +# can be used to strip a user defined part of the path. Stripping is +# only done if one of the specified strings matches the left-hand part of +# the path. It is allowed to use relative paths in the argument list. + +STRIP_FROM_PATH = + +# The INTERNAL_DOCS tag determines if documentation +# that is typed after a \internal command is included. If the tag is set +# to NO (the default) then the documentation will be excluded. +# Set it to YES to include the internal documentation. + +INTERNAL_DOCS = NO + +# If the CASE_SENSE_NAMES tag is set to NO then Doxygen will only generate +# file names in lower case letters. If set to YES upper case letters are also +# allowed. This is useful if you have classes or files whose names only differ +# in case and if your file system supports case sensitive file names. Windows +# users are adviced to set this option to NO. + +CASE_SENSE_NAMES = YES + +# If the SHORT_NAMES tag is set to YES, doxygen will generate much shorter +# (but less readable) file names. This can be useful is your file systems +# doesn't support long names like on DOS, Mac, or CD-ROM. + +SHORT_NAMES = NO + +# If the HIDE_SCOPE_NAMES tag is set to NO (the default) then Doxygen +# will show members with their full class and namespace scopes in the +# documentation. If set to YES the scope will be hidden. + +HIDE_SCOPE_NAMES = NO + +# If the VERBATIM_HEADERS tag is set to YES (the default) then Doxygen +# will generate a verbatim copy of the header file for each class for +# which an include is specified. Set to NO to disable this. + +VERBATIM_HEADERS = NO + +# If the SHOW_INCLUDE_FILES tag is set to YES (the default) then Doxygen +# will put list of the files that are included by a file in the documentation +# of that file. + +SHOW_INCLUDE_FILES = YES + +# If the JAVADOC_AUTOBRIEF tag is set to YES then Doxygen +# will interpret the first line (until the first dot) of a JavaDoc-style +# comment as the brief description. If set to NO, the JavaDoc +# comments will behave just like the Qt-style comments (thus requiring an +# explict @brief command for a brief description. + +JAVADOC_AUTOBRIEF = NO + +# The MULTILINE_CPP_IS_BRIEF tag can be set to YES to make Doxygen +# treat a multi-line C++ special comment block (i.e. a block of //! or /// +# comments) as a brief description. This used to be the default behaviour. +# The new default is to treat a multi-line C++ comment block as a detailed +# description. Set this tag to YES if you prefer the old behaviour instead. + +MULTILINE_CPP_IS_BRIEF = NO + +# If the DETAILS_AT_TOP tag is set to YES then Doxygen +# will output the detailed description near the top, like JavaDoc. +# If set to NO, the detailed description appears after the member +# documentation. + +DETAILS_AT_TOP = YES + +# If the INHERIT_DOCS tag is set to YES (the default) then an undocumented +# member inherits the documentation from any documented member that it +# reimplements. + +INHERIT_DOCS = YES + +# If the INLINE_INFO tag is set to YES (the default) then a tag [inline] +# is inserted in the documentation for inline members. + +INLINE_INFO = YES + +# If the SORT_MEMBER_DOCS tag is set to YES (the default) then doxygen +# will sort the (detailed) documentation of file and class members +# alphabetically by member name. If set to NO the members will appear in +# declaration order. + +SORT_MEMBER_DOCS = YES + +# If member grouping is used in the documentation and the DISTRIBUTE_GROUP_DOC +# tag is set to YES, then doxygen will reuse the documentation of the first +# member in the group (if any) for the other members of the group. By default +# all members of a group must be documented explicitly. + +DISTRIBUTE_GROUP_DOC = NO + +# The TAB_SIZE tag can be used to set the number of spaces in a tab. +# Doxygen uses this value to replace tabs by spaces in code fragments. + +TAB_SIZE = 8 + +# The GENERATE_TODOLIST tag can be used to enable (YES) or +# disable (NO) the todo list. This list is created by putting \todo +# commands in the documentation. + +GENERATE_TODOLIST = YES + +# The GENERATE_TESTLIST tag can be used to enable (YES) or +# disable (NO) the test list. This list is created by putting \test +# commands in the documentation. + +GENERATE_TESTLIST = YES + +# The GENERATE_BUGLIST tag can be used to enable (YES) or +# disable (NO) the bug list. This list is created by putting \bug +# commands in the documentation. + +GENERATE_BUGLIST = YES + +# The GENERATE_DEPRECATEDLIST tag can be used to enable (YES) or +# disable (NO) the deprecated list. This list is created by putting +# \deprecated commands in the documentation. + +GENERATE_DEPRECATEDLIST= YES + +# This tag can be used to specify a number of aliases that acts +# as commands in the documentation. An alias has the form "name=value". +# For example adding "sideeffect=\par Side Effects:\n" will allow you to +# put the command \sideeffect (or @sideeffect) in the documentation, which +# will result in a user defined paragraph with heading "Side Effects:". +# You can put \n's in the value part of an alias to insert newlines. + +ALIASES = + +# The ENABLED_SECTIONS tag can be used to enable conditional +# documentation sections, marked by \if sectionname ... \endif. + +ENABLED_SECTIONS = + +# The MAX_INITIALIZER_LINES tag determines the maximum number of lines +# the initial value of a variable or define consist of for it to appear in +# the documentation. If the initializer consists of more lines than specified +# here it will be hidden. Use a value of 0 to hide initializers completely. +# The appearance of the initializer of individual variables and defines in the +# documentation can be controlled using \showinitializer or \hideinitializer +# command in the documentation regardless of this setting. + +MAX_INITIALIZER_LINES = 30 + +# Set the OPTIMIZE_OUTPUT_FOR_C tag to YES if your project consists of C sources +# only. Doxygen will then generate output that is more tailored for C. +# For instance some of the names that are used will be different. The list +# of all members will be omitted, etc. + +OPTIMIZE_OUTPUT_FOR_C = NO + +# Set the OPTIMIZE_OUTPUT_JAVA tag to YES if your project consists of Java sources +# only. Doxygen will then generate output that is more tailored for Java. +# For instance namespaces will be presented as packages, qualified scopes +# will look different, etc. + +OPTIMIZE_OUTPUT_JAVA = NO + +# Set the SHOW_USED_FILES tag to NO to disable the list of files generated +# at the bottom of the documentation of classes and structs. If set to YES the +# list will mention the files that were used to generate the documentation. + +SHOW_USED_FILES = YES + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to warning and progress messages +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# The QUIET tag can be used to turn on/off the messages that are generated +# by doxygen. Possible values are YES and NO. If left blank NO is used. + +QUIET = NO + +# The WARNINGS tag can be used to turn on/off the warning messages that are +# generated by doxygen. Possible values are YES and NO. If left blank +# NO is used. + +WARNINGS = YES + +# If WARN_IF_UNDOCUMENTED is set to YES, then doxygen will generate warnings +# for undocumented members. If EXTRACT_ALL is set to YES then this flag will +# automatically be disabled. + +WARN_IF_UNDOCUMENTED = NO + +# If WARN_IF_DOC_ERROR is set to YES, doxygen will generate warnings for +# potential errors in the documentation, such as not documenting some +# parameters in a documented function, or documenting parameters that +# don't exist or using markup commands wrongly. + +WARN_IF_DOC_ERROR = YES + +# The WARN_FORMAT tag determines the format of the warning messages that +# doxygen can produce. The string should contain the $file, $line, and $text +# tags, which will be replaced by the file and line number from which the +# warning originated and the warning text. + +WARN_FORMAT = "$file:$line: $text" + +# The WARN_LOGFILE tag can be used to specify a file to which warning +# and error messages should be written. If left blank the output is written +# to stderr. + +WARN_LOGFILE = + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the input files +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# The INPUT tag can be used to specify the files and/or directories that contain +# documented source files. You may enter file names like "myfile.cpp" or +# directories like "/usr/src/myproject". Separate the files or directories +# with spaces. + +INPUT = \ + include/wx \ + include/wx/generic \ + include/wx/html \ + include/wx/protocol +#INPUT = include/wx/button.h + +# If the value of the INPUT tag contains directories, you can use the +# FILE_PATTERNS tag to specify one or more wildcard pattern (like *.cpp +# and *.h) to filter out the source-files in the directories. If left +# blank the following patterns are tested: +# *.c *.cc *.cxx *.cpp *.c++ *.java *.ii *.ixx *.ipp *.i++ *.inl *.h *.hh *.hxx *.hpp +# *.h++ *.idl *.odl + +FILE_PATTERNS = + +# The RECURSIVE tag can be used to turn specify whether or not subdirectories +# should be searched for input files as well. Possible values are YES and NO. +# If left blank NO is used. + +RECURSIVE = NO + +# The EXCLUDE tag can be used to specify files and/or directories that should +# excluded from the INPUT source files. This way you can easily exclude a +# subdirectory from a directory tree whose root is specified with the INPUT tag. + +EXCLUDE = + +# The EXCLUDE_SYMLINKS tag can be used select whether or not files or directories +# that are symbolic links (a Unix filesystem feature) are excluded from the input. + +EXCLUDE_SYMLINKS = YES + +# If the value of the INPUT tag contains directories, you can use the +# EXCLUDE_PATTERNS tag to specify one or more wildcard patterns to exclude +# certain files from those directories. + +EXCLUDE_PATTERNS = + +# The EXAMPLE_PATH tag can be used to specify one or more files or +# directories that contain example code fragments that are included (see +# the \include command). + +EXAMPLE_PATH = + +# If the value of the EXAMPLE_PATH tag contains directories, you can use the +# EXAMPLE_PATTERNS tag to specify one or more wildcard pattern (like *.cpp +# and *.h) to filter out the source-files in the directories. If left +# blank all files are included. + +EXAMPLE_PATTERNS = + +# If the EXAMPLE_RECURSIVE tag is set to YES then subdirectories will be +# searched for input files to be used with the \include or \dontinclude +# commands irrespective of the value of the RECURSIVE tag. +# Possible values are YES and NO. If left blank NO is used. + +EXAMPLE_RECURSIVE = NO + +# The IMAGE_PATH tag can be used to specify one or more files or +# directories that contain image that are included in the documentation (see +# the \image command). + +IMAGE_PATH = + +# The INPUT_FILTER tag can be used to specify a program that doxygen should +# invoke to filter for each input file. Doxygen will invoke the filter program +# by executing (via popen()) the command , where +# is the value of the INPUT_FILTER tag, and is the name of an +# input file. Doxygen will then use the output that the filter program writes +# to standard output. + +INPUT_FILTER = + +# If the FILTER_SOURCE_FILES tag is set to YES, the input filter (if set using +# INPUT_FILTER) will be used to filter the input files when producing source +# files to browse (i.e. when SOURCE_BROWSER is set to YES). + +FILTER_SOURCE_FILES = NO + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to source browsing +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# If the SOURCE_BROWSER tag is set to YES then a list of source files will +# be generated. Documented entities will be cross-referenced with these sources. + +SOURCE_BROWSER = NO + +# Setting the INLINE_SOURCES tag to YES will include the body +# of functions and classes directly in the documentation. + +INLINE_SOURCES = NO + +# Setting the STRIP_CODE_COMMENTS tag to YES (the default) will instruct +# doxygen to hide any special comment blocks from generated source code +# fragments. Normal C and C++ comments will always remain visible. + +STRIP_CODE_COMMENTS = YES + +# If the REFERENCED_BY_RELATION tag is set to YES (the default) +# then for each documented function all documented +# functions referencing it will be listed. + +REFERENCED_BY_RELATION = NO + +# If the REFERENCES_RELATION tag is set to YES (the default) +# then for each documented function all documented entities +# called/used by that function will be listed. + +REFERENCES_RELATION = NO + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the alphabetical class index +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# If the ALPHABETICAL_INDEX tag is set to YES, an alphabetical index +# of all compounds will be generated. Enable this if the project +# contains a lot of classes, structs, unions or interfaces. + +ALPHABETICAL_INDEX = YES + +# If the alphabetical index is enabled (see ALPHABETICAL_INDEX) then +# the COLS_IN_ALPHA_INDEX tag can be used to specify the number of columns +# in which this list will be split (can be a number in the range [1..20]) + +COLS_IN_ALPHA_INDEX = 5 + +# In case all classes in a project start with a common prefix, all +# classes will be put under the same header in the alphabetical index. +# The IGNORE_PREFIX tag can be used to specify one or more prefixes that +# should be ignored while generating the index headers. + +IGNORE_PREFIX = + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the HTML output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# If the GENERATE_HTML tag is set to YES (the default) Doxygen will +# generate HTML output. + +GENERATE_HTML = YES + +# The HTML_OUTPUT tag is used to specify where the HTML docs will be put. +# If a relative path is entered the value of OUTPUT_DIRECTORY will be +# put in front of it. If left blank `html' will be used as the default path. + +HTML_OUTPUT = html + +# The HTML_FILE_EXTENSION tag can be used to specify the file extension for +# each generated HTML page (for example: .htm,.php,.asp). If it is left blank +# doxygen will generate files with .html extension. + +HTML_FILE_EXTENSION = .html + +# The HTML_HEADER tag can be used to specify a personal HTML header for +# each generated HTML page. If it is left blank doxygen will generate a +# standard header. + +HTML_HEADER = + +# The HTML_FOOTER tag can be used to specify a personal HTML footer for +# each generated HTML page. If it is left blank doxygen will generate a +# standard footer. + +HTML_FOOTER = + +# The HTML_STYLESHEET tag can be used to specify a user defined cascading +# style sheet that is used by each HTML page. It can be used to +# fine-tune the look of the HTML output. If the tag is left blank doxygen +# will generate a default style sheet + +HTML_STYLESHEET = + +# If the HTML_ALIGN_MEMBERS tag is set to YES, the members of classes, +# files or namespaces will be aligned in HTML using tables. If set to +# NO a bullet list will be used. + +HTML_ALIGN_MEMBERS = YES + +# If the GENERATE_HTMLHELP tag is set to YES, additional index files +# will be generated that can be used as input for tools like the +# Microsoft HTML help workshop to generate a compressed HTML help file (.chm) +# of the generated HTML documentation. + +GENERATE_HTMLHELP = YES + +# If the GENERATE_HTMLHELP tag is set to YES, the CHM_FILE tag can +# be used to specify the file name of the resulting .chm file. You +# can add a path in front of the file if the result should not be +# written to the html output dir. + +CHM_FILE = wxwindows + +# If the GENERATE_HTMLHELP tag is set to YES, the HHC_LOCATION tag can +# be used to specify the location (absolute path including file name) of +# the HTML help compiler (hhc.exe). If non empty doxygen will try to run +# the html help compiler on the generated index.hhp. + +HHC_LOCATION = + +# If the GENERATE_HTMLHELP tag is set to YES, the GENERATE_CHI flag +# controls if a separate .chi index file is generated (YES) or that +# it should be included in the master .chm file (NO). + +GENERATE_CHI = YES + +# If the GENERATE_HTMLHELP tag is set to YES, the BINARY_TOC flag +# controls whether a binary table of contents is generated (YES) or a +# normal table of contents (NO) in the .chm file. + +BINARY_TOC = NO + +# The TOC_EXPAND flag can be set to YES to add extra items for group members +# to the contents of the Html help documentation and to the tree view. + +TOC_EXPAND = YES + +# The DISABLE_INDEX tag can be used to turn on/off the condensed index at +# top of each HTML page. The value NO (the default) enables the index and +# the value YES disables it. + +DISABLE_INDEX = NO + +# This tag can be used to set the number of enum values (range [1..20]) +# that doxygen will group on one line in the generated HTML documentation. + +ENUM_VALUES_PER_LINE = 4 + +# If the GENERATE_TREEVIEW tag is set to YES, a side panel will be +# generated containing a tree-like index structure (just like the one that +# is generated for HTML Help). For this to work a browser that supports +# JavaScript, DHTML, CSS and frames is required (for instance Mozilla, +# Netscape 6.0+, Internet explorer 5.0+, or Konqueror). Windows users are +# probably better off using the HTML help feature. + +GENERATE_TREEVIEW = YES + +# If the treeview is enabled (see GENERATE_TREEVIEW) then this tag can be +# used to set the initial width (in pixels) of the frame in which the tree +# is shown. + +TREEVIEW_WIDTH = 250 + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the LaTeX output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# If the GENERATE_LATEX tag is set to YES (the default) Doxygen will +# generate Latex output. + +GENERATE_LATEX = NO + +# The LATEX_OUTPUT tag is used to specify where the LaTeX docs will be put. +# If a relative path is entered the value of OUTPUT_DIRECTORY will be +# put in front of it. If left blank `latex' will be used as the default path. + +LATEX_OUTPUT = latex + +# The LATEX_CMD_NAME tag can be used to specify the LaTeX command name to be +# invoked. If left blank `latex' will be used as the default command name. + +LATEX_CMD_NAME = latex + +# The MAKEINDEX_CMD_NAME tag can be used to specify the command name to +# generate index for LaTeX. If left blank `makeindex' will be used as the +# default command name. + +MAKEINDEX_CMD_NAME = makeindex + +# If the COMPACT_LATEX tag is set to YES Doxygen generates more compact +# LaTeX documents. This may be useful for small projects and may help to +# save some trees in general. + +COMPACT_LATEX = NO + +# The PAPER_TYPE tag can be used to set the paper type that is used +# by the printer. Possible values are: a4, a4wide, letter, legal and +# executive. If left blank a4wide will be used. + +PAPER_TYPE = a4wide + +# The EXTRA_PACKAGES tag can be to specify one or more names of LaTeX +# packages that should be included in the LaTeX output. + +EXTRA_PACKAGES = + +# The LATEX_HEADER tag can be used to specify a personal LaTeX header for +# the generated latex document. The header should contain everything until +# the first chapter. If it is left blank doxygen will generate a +# standard header. Notice: only use this tag if you know what you are doing! + +LATEX_HEADER = + +# If the PDF_HYPERLINKS tag is set to YES, the LaTeX that is generated +# is prepared for conversion to pdf (using ps2pdf). The pdf file will +# contain links (just like the HTML output) instead of page references +# This makes the output suitable for online browsing using a pdf viewer. + +PDF_HYPERLINKS = NO + +# If the USE_PDFLATEX tag is set to YES, pdflatex will be used instead of +# plain latex in the generated Makefile. Set this option to YES to get a +# higher quality PDF documentation. + +USE_PDFLATEX = NO + +# If the LATEX_BATCHMODE tag is set to YES, doxygen will add the \\batchmode. +# command to the generated LaTeX files. This will instruct LaTeX to keep +# running if errors occur, instead of asking the user for help. +# This option is also used when generating formulas in HTML. + +LATEX_BATCHMODE = NO + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the RTF output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# If the GENERATE_RTF tag is set to YES Doxygen will generate RTF output +# The RTF output is optimised for Word 97 and may not look very pretty with +# other RTF readers or editors. + +GENERATE_RTF = NO + +# The RTF_OUTPUT tag is used to specify where the RTF docs will be put. +# If a relative path is entered the value of OUTPUT_DIRECTORY will be +# put in front of it. If left blank `rtf' will be used as the default path. + +RTF_OUTPUT = rtf + +# If the COMPACT_RTF tag is set to YES Doxygen generates more compact +# RTF documents. This may be useful for small projects and may help to +# save some trees in general. + +COMPACT_RTF = NO + +# If the RTF_HYPERLINKS tag is set to YES, the RTF that is generated +# will contain hyperlink fields. The RTF file will +# contain links (just like the HTML output) instead of page references. +# This makes the output suitable for online browsing using WORD or other +# programs which support those fields. +# Note: wordpad (write) and others do not support links. + +RTF_HYPERLINKS = NO + +# Load stylesheet definitions from file. Syntax is similar to doxygen's +# config file, i.e. a series of assigments. You only have to provide +# replacements, missing definitions are set to their default value. + +RTF_STYLESHEET_FILE = + +# Set optional variables used in the generation of an rtf document. +# Syntax is similar to doxygen's config file. + +RTF_EXTENSIONS_FILE = + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the man page output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# If the GENERATE_MAN tag is set to YES (the default) Doxygen will +# generate man pages + +GENERATE_MAN = NO + +# The MAN_OUTPUT tag is used to specify where the man pages will be put. +# If a relative path is entered the value of OUTPUT_DIRECTORY will be +# put in front of it. If left blank `man' will be used as the default path. + +MAN_OUTPUT = man + +# The MAN_EXTENSION tag determines the extension that is added to +# the generated man pages (default is the subroutine's section .3) + +MAN_EXTENSION = .3 + +# If the MAN_LINKS tag is set to YES and Doxygen generates man output, +# then it will generate one additional man file for each entity +# documented in the real man page(s). These additional files +# only source the real man page, but without them the man command +# would be unable to find the correct page. The default is NO. + +MAN_LINKS = NO + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the XML output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# If the GENERATE_XML tag is set to YES Doxygen will +# generate an XML file that captures the structure of +# the code including all documentation. Note that this +# feature is still experimental and incomplete at the +# moment. + +GENERATE_XML = NO + +# The XML_SCHEMA tag can be used to specify an XML schema, +# which can be used by a validating XML parser to check the +# syntax of the XML files. + +XML_SCHEMA = + +# The XML_DTD tag can be used to specify an XML DTD, +# which can be used by a validating XML parser to check the +# syntax of the XML files. + +XML_DTD = + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options for the AutoGen Definitions output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# If the GENERATE_AUTOGEN_DEF tag is set to YES Doxygen will +# generate an AutoGen Definitions (see autogen.sf.net) file +# that captures the structure of the code including all +# documentation. Note that this feature is still experimental +# and incomplete at the moment. + +GENERATE_AUTOGEN_DEF = NO + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the Perl module output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# If the GENERATE_PERLMOD tag is set to YES Doxygen will +# generate a Perl module file that captures the structure of +# the code including all documentation. Note that this +# feature is still experimental and incomplete at the +# moment. + +GENERATE_PERLMOD = NO + +# If the PERLMOD_LATEX tag is set to YES Doxygen will generate +# the necessary Makefile rules, Perl scripts and LaTeX code to be able +# to generate PDF and DVI output from the Perl module output. + +PERLMOD_LATEX = NO + +# If the PERLMOD_PRETTY tag is set to YES the Perl module output will be +# nicely formatted so it can be parsed by a human reader. This is useful +# if you want to understand what is going on. On the other hand, if this +# tag is set to NO the size of the Perl module output will be much smaller +# and Perl will parse it just the same. + +PERLMOD_PRETTY = YES + +# The names of the make variables in the generated doxyrules.make file +# are prefixed with the string contained in PERLMOD_MAKEVAR_PREFIX. +# This is useful so different doxyrules.make files included by the same +# Makefile don't overwrite each other's variables. + +PERLMOD_MAKEVAR_PREFIX = + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# Configuration options related to the preprocessor +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# If the ENABLE_PREPROCESSING tag is set to YES (the default) Doxygen will +# evaluate all C-preprocessor directives found in the sources and include +# files. + +ENABLE_PREPROCESSING = YES + +# If the MACRO_EXPANSION tag is set to YES Doxygen will expand all macro +# names in the source code. If set to NO (the default) only conditional +# compilation will be performed. Macro expansion can be done in a controlled +# way by setting EXPAND_ONLY_PREDEF to YES. + +MACRO_EXPANSION = YES + +# If the EXPAND_ONLY_PREDEF and MACRO_EXPANSION tags are both set to YES +# then the macro expansion is limited to the macros specified with the +# PREDEFINED and EXPAND_AS_PREDEFINED tags. + +EXPAND_ONLY_PREDEF = YES + +# If the SEARCH_INCLUDES tag is set to YES (the default) the includes files +# in the INCLUDE_PATH (see below) will be search if a #include is found. + +SEARCH_INCLUDES = YES + +# The INCLUDE_PATH tag can be used to specify one or more directories that +# contain include files that are not input files but should be processed by +# the preprocessor. + +INCLUDE_PATH = + +# You can use the INCLUDE_FILE_PATTERNS tag to specify one or more wildcard +# patterns (like *.h and *.hpp) to filter out the header-files in the +# directories. If left blank, the patterns specified with FILE_PATTERNS will +# be used. + +INCLUDE_FILE_PATTERNS = + +# The PREDEFINED tag can be used to specify one or more macro names that +# are defined before the preprocessor is started (similar to the -D option of +# gcc). The argument of the tag is a list of macros of the form: name +# or name=definition (no spaces). If the definition and the = are +# omitted =1 is assumed. + +PREDEFINED = \ + DOXYGEN \ + DOC_DONT_EXTRACT \ + wxUSE_UNICODE \ + wxUSE_BUTTON \ + WXUNUSED(x)=x \ + wxButtonBase=wxButton \ + WXDLLEXPORT= \ + WXDLLEXPORT_DATA(name)=name + +# If the MACRO_EXPANSION and EXPAND_ONLY_PREDEF tags are set to YES then +# this tag can be used to specify a list of macro names that should be expanded. +# The macro definition that is found in the sources will be used. +# Use the PREDEFINED tag if you want to use a different macro definition. + +EXPAND_AS_DEFINED = + +# If the SKIP_FUNCTION_MACROS tag is set to YES (the default) then +# doxygen's preprocessor will remove all function-like macros that are alone +# on a line, have an all uppercase name, and do not end with a semicolon. Such +# function macros are typically used for boiler-plate code, and will confuse the +# parser if not removed. + +SKIP_FUNCTION_MACROS = YES + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# Configuration::addtions related to external references +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# The TAGFILES tag can be used to specify one or more tagfiles. + +TAGFILES = + +# When a file name is specified after GENERATE_TAGFILE, doxygen will create +# a tag file that is based on the input files it reads. + +GENERATE_TAGFILE = + +# If the ALLEXTERNALS tag is set to YES all external classes will be listed +# in the class index. If set to NO only the inherited external classes +# will be listed. + +ALLEXTERNALS = NO + +# If the EXTERNAL_GROUPS tag is set to YES all external groups will be listed +# in the modules index. If set to NO, only the current project's groups will +# be listed. + +EXTERNAL_GROUPS = YES + +# The PERL_PATH should be the absolute path and name of the perl script +# interpreter (i.e. the result of `which perl'). + +PERL_PATH = /usr/bin/perl + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# Configuration options related to the dot tool +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# If the CLASS_DIAGRAMS tag is set to YES (the default) Doxygen will +# generate a inheritance diagram (in Html, RTF and LaTeX) for classes with base or +# super classes. Setting the tag to NO turns the diagrams off. Note that this +# option is superceded by the HAVE_DOT option below. This is only a fallback. It is +# recommended to install and use dot, since it yield more powerful graphs. + +CLASS_DIAGRAMS = YES + +# If set to YES, the inheritance and collaboration graphs will hide +# inheritance and usage relations if the target is undocumented +# or is not a class. + +HIDE_UNDOC_RELATIONS = NO + +# If you set the HAVE_DOT tag to YES then doxygen will assume the dot tool is +# available from the path. This tool is part of Graphviz, a graph visualization +# toolkit from AT&T and Lucent Bell Labs. The other options in this section +# have no effect if this option is set to NO (the default) + +HAVE_DOT = YES + +# If the CLASS_GRAPH and HAVE_DOT tags are set to YES then doxygen +# will generate a graph for each documented class showing the direct and +# indirect inheritance relations. Setting this tag to YES will force the +# the CLASS_DIAGRAMS tag to NO. + +CLASS_GRAPH = YES + +# If the COLLABORATION_GRAPH and HAVE_DOT tags are set to YES then doxygen +# will generate a graph for each documented class showing the direct and +# indirect implementation dependencies (inheritance, containment, and +# class references variables) of the class with other documented classes. + +COLLABORATION_GRAPH = NO + +# If set to YES, the inheritance and collaboration graphs will show the +# relations between templates and their instances. + +TEMPLATE_RELATIONS = NO + +# If the ENABLE_PREPROCESSING, SEARCH_INCLUDES, INCLUDE_GRAPH, and HAVE_DOT +# tags are set to YES then doxygen will generate a graph for each documented +# file showing the direct and indirect include dependencies of the file with +# other documented files. + +INCLUDE_GRAPH = NO + +# If the ENABLE_PREPROCESSING, SEARCH_INCLUDES, INCLUDED_BY_GRAPH, and +# HAVE_DOT tags are set to YES then doxygen will generate a graph for each +# documented header file showing the documented files that directly or +# indirectly include this file. + +INCLUDED_BY_GRAPH = NO + +# If the GRAPHICAL_HIERARCHY and HAVE_DOT tags are set to YES then doxygen +# will graphical hierarchy of all classes instead of a textual one. + +GRAPHICAL_HIERARCHY = YES + +# The DOT_IMAGE_FORMAT tag can be used to set the image format of the images +# generated by dot. Possible values are png, jpg, or gif +# If left blank png will be used. + +DOT_IMAGE_FORMAT = png + +# The tag DOT_PATH can be used to specify the path where the dot tool can be +# found. If left blank, it is assumed the dot tool can be found on the path. + +DOT_PATH = + +# The DOTFILE_DIRS tag can be used to specify one or more directories that +# contain dot files that are included in the documentation (see the +# \dotfile command). + +DOTFILE_DIRS = + +# The MAX_DOT_GRAPH_WIDTH tag can be used to set the maximum allowed width +# (in pixels) of the graphs generated by dot. If a graph becomes larger than +# this value, doxygen will try to truncate the graph, so that it fits within +# the specified constraint. Beware that most browsers cannot cope with very +# large images. + +MAX_DOT_GRAPH_WIDTH = 1024 + +# The MAX_DOT_GRAPH_HEIGHT tag can be used to set the maximum allows height +# (in pixels) of the graphs generated by dot. If a graph becomes larger than +# this value, doxygen will try to truncate the graph, so that it fits within +# the specified constraint. Beware that most browsers cannot cope with very +# large images. + +MAX_DOT_GRAPH_HEIGHT = 1024 + +# If the GENERATE_LEGEND tag is set to YES (the default) Doxygen will +# generate a legend page explaining the meaning of the various boxes and +# arrows in the dot generated graphs. + +GENERATE_LEGEND = NO + +# If the DOT_CLEANUP tag is set to YES (the default) Doxygen will +# remove the intermedate dot files that are used to generate +# the various graphs. + +DOT_CLEANUP = YES + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# Configuration::addtions related to the search engine +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- + +# The SEARCHENGINE tag specifies whether or not a search engine should be +# used. If set to NO the values of all tags below this one will be ignored. + +SEARCHENGINE = NO + +# The CGI_NAME tag should be the name of the CGI script that +# starts the search engine (doxysearch) with the correct parameters. +# A script with this name will be generated by doxygen. + +CGI_NAME = search.cgi + +# The CGI_URL tag should be the absolute URL to the directory where the +# cgi binaries are located. See the documentation of your http daemon for +# details. + +CGI_URL = + +# The DOC_URL tag should be the absolute URL to the directory where the +# documentation is located. If left blank the absolute path to the +# documentation, with file:// prepended to it, will be used. + +DOC_URL = + +# The DOC_ABSPATH tag should be the absolute path to the directory where the +# documentation is located. If left blank the directory on the local machine +# will be used. + +DOC_ABSPATH = + +# The BIN_ABSPATH tag must point to the directory where the doxysearch binary +# is installed. + +BIN_ABSPATH = /usr/local/bin/ + +# The EXT_DOC_PATHS tag can be used to specify one or more paths to +# documentation generated for other projects. This allows doxysearch to search +# the documentation for these projects as well. + +EXT_DOC_PATHS = diff -urN wxWindows-2.4.0.orig/Doxyfile.bak wxWindows-2.4.0/Doxyfile.bak --- wxWindows-2.4.0.orig/Doxyfile.bak 1970-01-01 01:00:00.000000000 +0100 +++ wxWindows-2.4.0/Doxyfile.bak 2003-06-07 17:56:59.000000000 +0100 @@ -0,0 +1,186 @@ +# Doxyfile 1.2.13-20020210 + +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# General configuration options +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +PROJECT_NAME = wxWindows (Experimental) +PROJECT_NUMBER = +OUTPUT_DIRECTORY = .. +OUTPUT_LANGUAGE = English +EXTRACT_ALL = YES +EXTRACT_PRIVATE = YES +EXTRACT_STATIC = YES +EXTRACT_LOCAL_CLASSES = YES +HIDE_UNDOC_MEMBERS = NO +HIDE_UNDOC_CLASSES = NO +BRIEF_MEMBER_DESC = YES +REPEAT_BRIEF = YES +ALWAYS_DETAILED_SEC = YES +INLINE_INHERITED_MEMB = YES +FULL_PATH_NAMES = NO +STRIP_FROM_PATH = +INTERNAL_DOCS = NO +STRIP_CODE_COMMENTS = YES +CASE_SENSE_NAMES = YES +SHORT_NAMES = NO +HIDE_SCOPE_NAMES = NO +VERBATIM_HEADERS = YES +SHOW_INCLUDE_FILES = YES +JAVADOC_AUTOBRIEF = NO +INHERIT_DOCS = YES +INLINE_INFO = YES +SORT_MEMBER_DOCS = YES +DISTRIBUTE_GROUP_DOC = NO +TAB_SIZE = 8 +GENERATE_TODOLIST = YES +GENERATE_TESTLIST = YES +GENERATE_BUGLIST = YES +ALIASES = +ENABLED_SECTIONS = +MAX_INITIALIZER_LINES = 30 +OPTIMIZE_OUTPUT_FOR_C = YES +OPTIMIZE_OUTPUT_JAVA = NO +SHOW_USED_FILES = YES +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to warning and progress messages +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +QUIET = NO +WARNINGS = YES +WARN_IF_UNDOCUMENTED = YES +WARN_FORMAT = "$file:$line: $text" +WARN_LOGFILE = +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the input files +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +INPUT = include/wx +FILE_PATTERNS = +RECURSIVE = YES +EXCLUDE = +EXCLUDE_SYMLINKS = NO +# EXCLUDE_PATTERNS = */include/wx/isql* */include/wx/gtk/* */include/wx/msw/* */include/wx/cocoa/* */include/wx/motif/* */include/wx/mac/* */include/wx/unix/* */include/wx/univ/* */include/wx/os2/* */include/wx/x11/* */include/wx/mgl/* */include/wx/qt/* +EXCLUDE_PATTERNS = */include/wx/isql* */include/wx/msw/* */include/wx/cocoa/* */include/wx/motif/* */include/wx/mac/* */include/wx/unix/* */include/wx/univ/* */include/wx/os2/* */include/wx/x11/* */include/wx/mgl/* */include/wx/qt/* +EXAMPLE_PATH = +EXAMPLE_PATTERNS = +EXAMPLE_RECURSIVE = NO +IMAGE_PATH = +INPUT_FILTER = +FILTER_SOURCE_FILES = NO +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to source browsing +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +SOURCE_BROWSER = YES +INLINE_SOURCES = YES +REFERENCED_BY_RELATION = YES +REFERENCES_RELATION = YES +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the alphabetical class index +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +ALPHABETICAL_INDEX = YES +COLS_IN_ALPHA_INDEX = 5 +IGNORE_PREFIX = +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the HTML output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +GENERATE_HTML = YES +HTML_OUTPUT = html +HTML_FILE_EXTENSION = .html +HTML_HEADER = +HTML_FOOTER = +HTML_STYLESHEET = +HTML_ALIGN_MEMBERS = YES +GENERATE_HTMLHELP = NO +GENERATE_CHI = NO +BINARY_TOC = NO +TOC_EXPAND = YES +DISABLE_INDEX = NO +ENUM_VALUES_PER_LINE = 4 +GENERATE_TREEVIEW = YES +TREEVIEW_WIDTH = 250 +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the LaTeX output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +GENERATE_LATEX = NO +LATEX_OUTPUT = latex +LATEX_CMD_NAME = latex +MAKEINDEX_CMD_NAME = makeindex +COMPACT_LATEX = NO +PAPER_TYPE = a4wide +EXTRA_PACKAGES = +LATEX_HEADER = +PDF_HYPERLINKS = NO +USE_PDFLATEX = NO +LATEX_BATCHMODE = NO +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the RTF output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +GENERATE_RTF = NO +RTF_OUTPUT = rtf +COMPACT_RTF = NO +RTF_HYPERLINKS = NO +RTF_STYLESHEET_FILE = +RTF_EXTENSIONS_FILE = +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the man page output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +GENERATE_MAN = NO +MAN_OUTPUT = man +MAN_EXTENSION = .3 +MAN_LINKS = NO +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options related to the XML output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +GENERATE_XML = YES +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# configuration options for the AutoGen Definitions output +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +GENERATE_AUTOGEN_DEF = NO +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# Configuration options related to the preprocessor +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +ENABLE_PREPROCESSING = YES +MACRO_EXPANSION = YES +EXPAND_ONLY_PREDEF = NO +SEARCH_INCLUDES = YES +INCLUDE_PATH = +INCLUDE_FILE_PATTERNS = +#PREDEFINED = DOC_DONT_EXTRACT wxUSE_UNICODE # wxUNUSED(x)=x WXDLLEXPORT_DATA(name)=name +PREDEFINED = DOC_DONT_EXTRACT wxUSE_UNICODE wxUNUSED(x)=x WXDLLEXPORT_DATA(name)=name +EXPAND_AS_DEFINED = +SKIP_FUNCTION_MACROS = YES +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# Configuration::addtions related to external references +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +TAGFILES = +GENERATE_TAGFILE = +ALLEXTERNALS = NO +EXTERNAL_GROUPS = YES +PERL_PATH = /usr/bin/perl +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# Configuration options related to the dot tool +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +CLASS_DIAGRAMS = YES +HAVE_DOT = YES +CLASS_GRAPH = YES +COLLABORATION_GRAPH = YES +TEMPLATE_RELATIONS = YES +HIDE_UNDOC_RELATIONS = NO +INCLUDE_GRAPH = YES +INCLUDED_BY_GRAPH = YES +GRAPHICAL_HIERARCHY = YES +DOT_IMAGE_FORMAT = png +DOT_PATH = /usr/bin/ +DOTFILE_DIRS = +MAX_DOT_GRAPH_WIDTH = 1024 +MAX_DOT_GRAPH_HEIGHT = 1024 +GENERATE_LEGEND = YES +DOT_CLEANUP = YES +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +# Configuration::addtions related to the search engine +#--------------------------------------------------------------------------- +SEARCHENGINE = NO +CGI_NAME = search.cgi +CGI_URL = +DOC_URL = +DOC_ABSPATH = +BIN_ABSPATH = /usr/local/bin/ +EXT_DOC_PATHS = diff -urN wxWindows-2.4.0.orig/include/wx/button.h wxWindows-2.4.0/include/wx/button.h --- wxWindows-2.4.0.orig/include/wx/button.h 2002-09-02 16:18:25.000000000 +0100 +++ wxWindows-2.4.0/include/wx/button.h 2003-06-07 19:18:00.000000000 +0100 @@ -1,62 +1,141 @@ -///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// -// Name: wx/button.h -// Purpose: wxButtonBase class -// Author: Vadim Zetlin -// Modified by: -// Created: 15.08.00 -// RCS-ID: $Id: button.h,v 1.10 2002/09/02 15:18:25 VZ Exp $ -// Copyright: (c) Vadim Zetlin -// Licence: wxWindows licence -///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// +/*! + * \file wx/button.h + * \brief wxButtonBase class. + * + * \author Vadim Zetlin + */ + +/* + * Modified by: + * Created: 15.08.00 + * RCS-ID: $Id: button.h,v 1.10 2002/09/02 15:18:25 VZ Exp $ + * Copyright: (c) Vadim Zetlin + * Licence: wxWindows licence + */ #ifndef _WX_BUTTON_H_BASE_ #define _WX_BUTTON_H_BASE_ #if wxUSE_BUTTON -// ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -// wxButton flags -// ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -// These two flags are obsolete -#define wxBU_NOAUTODRAW 0x0000 -#define wxBU_AUTODRAW 0x0004 - -// These flags affect label alignment -#define wxBU_LEFT 0x0040 -#define wxBU_TOP 0x0080 -#define wxBU_RIGHT 0x0100 -#define wxBU_BOTTOM 0x0200 - -// by default, the buttons will be created with some (system dependent) -// minimal size to make them look nicer, giving this style will make them as -// small as possible + +/*! + * \name wxButton flags + * + * See also \ref windowstyles. + */ +/*@{*/ + +#define wxBU_NOAUTODRAW 0x0000 //!< \deprecated +#define wxBU_AUTODRAW 0x0004 //!< \deprecated + +#define wxBU_LEFT 0x0040 //!< Left-justifies the label. WIN32 only. +#define wxBU_TOP 0x0080 //!< Aligns the label to the top of the button. WIN32 only. +#define wxBU_RIGHT 0x0100 //!< Right-justifies the bitmap label. WIN32 only. +#define wxBU_BOTTOM 0x0200 //!< Aligns the label to the bottom of the button. WIN32 only. + +//! Creates the button as small as possible instead of making it of the standard size (which is the default behaviour). +/*! + * By default, the buttons will be created with some (system dependent) minimal + * size to make them look nicer, giving this style will make them as small as + * possible. + */ #define wxBU_EXACTFIT 0x0001 +/*@}*/ + + #include "wx/control.h" class WXDLLEXPORT wxBitmap; WXDLLEXPORT_DATA(extern const wxChar*) wxButtonNameStr; -// ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -// wxButton: a push button -// ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- +//! A push button +/*! + * A button is a control that contains a text string, and is one of the + * commonest elements of a GUI. It may be placed on a \link wxDialog dialog box + * \endlink or \link wxPanel panel \endlink, or indeed almost any other window. + * + * \par Event handling: + * + * + * + * + * + *
    EVT_BUTTON(id, func)Process a wxEVT_COMMAND_BUTTON_CLICKED event, when the button is + * clicked.
    + * + * \sa wxBitmapButton + */ class WXDLLEXPORT wxButtonBase : public wxControl { public: - // show the image in the button in addition to the label + +#ifdef DOXYGEN + //! Default constructor. + /*! + * Constructor, creating and showing a button. + * + * \param parent Parent window. Must not be NULL. + * \param id Button identifier. A value of -1 indicates a default value. + * \param label label Text to be displayed on the button. + * \param pos Button position. + * \param size Button size. If the default size (-1, -1) is specified then the button is sized +appropriately for the text. + * \param style Window style. See \link button.h button.h \endlink. + * \param validator Window validator. + * \param name Window name. + * + * \sa wxButton::Create, wxValidator. + */ + void wxButton(wxWindow* parent, wxWindowID id, const wxString& label, const + wxPoint& pos, const wxSize& size = wxDefaultSize, long style = 0, + const wxValidator& validator, const wxString& name = "button"); + + + //! Button creation function for two-step creation. + /*! + * For more details, see wxButton::wxButton. + */ + void wxCreate(wxWindow* parent, wxWindowID id, const wxString& label, const + wxPoint& pos, const wxSize& size = wxDefaultSize, long style = 0, + const wxValidator& validator, const wxString& name = "button"); +#endif + + //! Show the image in the button in addition to the label virtual void SetImageLabel(const wxBitmap& WXUNUSED(bitmap)) { } - // set the margins around the image + //! Set the margins around the image virtual void SetImageMargins(wxCoord WXUNUSED(x), wxCoord WXUNUSED(y)) { } - // this wxButton method is called when the button becomes the default one - // on its panel + //! This sets the button to be the default item for the panel or dialog box + /*! + * \remark + * Under Windows, only dialog box buttons respond to this function. As normal + * under Windows and Motif, pressing return causes the default button to be + * depressed when the return key is pressed. See also wxWindow::SetFocus which + * sets the keyboard focus for windows and text panel items, and + * wxPanel::SetDefaultItem. + * + * \remark + * Note that under Motif, calling this function immediately after + * creation of a button and before the creation of other buttons + * will cause misalignment of the row of buttons, since default + * buttons are larger. To get around this, call wxButton::SetDefault + * after you have created a row of buttons: wxWindows will + * then set the size of all buttons currently on the panel to + * the same size. + */ virtual void SetDefault() { } - // returns the default button size for this platform + //! Returns the default size for the buttons + /*! + * It is advised to make all the dialog + * buttons of the same size and this function allows to retrieve the (platform and + * current font dependent size) which should be the best suited for this. + */ static wxSize GetDefaultSize(); }; --ibTvN161/egqYuK8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org --ibTvN161/egqYuK8-- From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Wed Jun 11 01:50:53 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 01:50:53 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19PstB-0003Jf-00 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 01:50:53 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5ANomYJ018739 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 01:50:49 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5ANomNQ018063 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 01:50:48 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5ANomLM018062 (8.12.9/1.3); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 01:50:48 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5ANolNQ018050 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 01:50:47 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 27420 invoked by uid 43863); 10 Jun 2003 23:50:33 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 27407 invoked from network); 10 Jun 2003 23:50:33 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 01:49:14 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[12]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <15EFDFD7-93C7-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> <8AqEa.3079$0d7.89727@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> In-Reply-To: <8AqEa.3079$0d7.89727@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h5ANomYJ018739 Status: RO Content-Length: 3708 Lines: 101 On Sat, 07 Jun 2003 18:57:08 GMT Jos=E9 Fonseca = wrote: JF> > Do you have any idea about how to modify Doxygen to do what I aske= d JF> > for above? I surely don't. JF>=20 JF> I really don't exactly in what way you want to modify it.=20 Me neither but it's clear that it should have some knowledge about wxWin event macros. JF> Do you want to Doxygen to extract the events from the source somehow?= If JF> so then I can't tell you - I'm not a Doxygen maintainer. Try Ask in o= ne JF> of their lists if you really want an answer. It shouldn't be more JF> difficult to modify than with any other other tool and easier than pu= ll JF> off your own script. No because if I were the Doxygen maintainer (and a Qt fan BTW -- there i= s nothing wrong with this, of course, but just helps to to imagine the situation better) I surely wouldn't want to modify my tool to have some special knowledge of the ugly macros used by a 3rd party GUI library competing with Qt. JF> > > seperate what you have in a User Manual and a Reference Manual. JF> >=20 JF> > Who is going to spend twice as much time maintaining both of them? JF>=20 JF> You must be joking, right? Since when breaking a complex problem in JF> n-pieces takes as much as n-times the time it took to solve originall= y?=20 There will be an overlap between the 2. And I certainly don't have time = to maintain a (real) manual because it is much more complicated than the reference. So no, I'm not joking -- I'm drawing your attention to the mos= t serious problem of this proposal. JF> The resulting output is: JF>=20 JF> http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/html/classwxButton.html JF> http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/html/button_8h.html Sorry, I get a 404. JF> Now take a look to the source code: JF>=20 JF> http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/include/wx/button.h JF>=20 JF> And compare it with the latex source: JF>=20 JF> http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/misc/wx/docs/latex/wx/button.tex Same here. JF> Which one is easier to write and maintain? Can anybody with a honest JF> face tell me that the source is cluttered, or that flexibility was lo= st? JF> Yes, takes time to convert, but only if there is strong sign from the JF> wxWindows maintainers to change that volunteers can be mobilized, aid= ing JF> scripts can be written, and the corner cases can be taken care of. I JF> think that it's the lack of familiarity with Doxygen which is prevent= ing JF> the people who can make the decision from properly avaliate the JF> advantages/disadvantages of doing so, spite of the enourmous JF> internal/external community support around Doxygen. Why do you think that I'm not familiar with Doxygen? I've used it in at least 5 projects (I probably forget some more) and I think that I might know it better than many people pushing for using it -- because unlike th= em I see its problems and not only its advantages. JF> No need to contradict me - this is my final argument anyway. If this JF> doesn't convince the ceptics then nothing I say or do will ever do, a= nd JF> spite I'm very found of wxWindows I can't waste more time and energy JF> arguing on this issue. Arguing is not very interesting. Solving the problems and doing somethin= g is much more so. I don't argue about phylosophical points (whether it mak= es the source more or less readable and so on), but about technical ones. An= d I still see quite a few problems before we could seriously consider switching to doxygen. Regards, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Wed Jun 11 12:26:16 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:26:16 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Q2o4-0005Cx-00 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:26:16 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5BAQCYb004039 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:26:12 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5BAQCNQ002916 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:26:12 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5BAQCrN002915 (8.12.9/1.3); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:26:12 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5BAQBNQ002900 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:26:11 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 6464 invoked by uid 43863); 11 Jun 2003 10:25:55 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 6457 invoked by uid 509); 11 Jun 2003 10:25:55 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Wed Jun 11 10:25:55 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!newsfeed1.uni2.dk!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.stueberl.de!newspeer1-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9?= Fonseca Subject: Re: Re[12]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) References: <15EFDFD7-93C7-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> <8AqEa.3079$0d7.89727@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 User-Agent: slrn/0.9.7.4 (Linux) Message-ID: <7sDFa.7835$0d7.229802@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 10:25:07 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 81.101.209.100 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net 1055327107 81.101.209.100 (Wed, 11 Jun 2003 11:25:07 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 11:25:07 BST Organization: ntl Cablemodem News Service Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25887 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h5BAQCYb004039 Status: RO Content-Length: 1625 Lines: 32 Vadim, In article , Vadim Zeitlin wrote= : > Arguing is not very interesting. Solving the problems and doing someth= ing > is much more so. I don't argue about phylosophical points (whether it m= akes > the source more or less readable and so on), but about technical ones. = And > I still see quite a few problems before we could seriously consider > switching to doxygen. I _did_ something about it - I've lost two hours to make a good example of how to use Doxygen with wxWindows documentation, and that addressed _your_ particular concerned of how to write events. I did this, uploaded to my website and posted on wx-users _4_ days ago and received _no_ reply whatsoever (AFAICT, people started a new thread which gathered consensus towards using some kind of tool mixture keeping the docs out of the source). In my original post I said I would remove the links in a couple of days (it was merely a temporary example and not a permanent resource), and due to the complete lack of interest shown I did so yesterday. I'm sorry that you didn't read it in time. I no longer have any of that material and I wont loose more time remaking it again. If someone else wants to remake it, I've posted the patch with the changes I made to the list afterwards. See: http://lists.wxwindows.org/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?8:mss:38239:200306:noinjokco= fjfpiomjmja Regards, Jos=E9 Fonseca --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Wed Jun 11 13:15:43 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:15:43 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Q3Zv-0005JF-00 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:15:43 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5BBFcYb004836 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:15:39 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5BBFcNQ016295 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:15:38 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5BBFcE9016293 (8.12.9/1.3); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:15:38 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5BBFbNQ016280 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:15:37 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 18795 invoked by uid 43863); 11 Jun 2003 11:15:22 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 18788 invoked from network); 11 Jun 2003 11:15:22 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.1.20030611121326.0396ecd8@mail.btinternet.com> X-Sender: julian.smart@mail.btinternet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:15:18 +0100 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org From: Julian Smart Subject: Re: Re[12]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) In-Reply-To: <7sDFa.7835$0d7.229802@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> References: <15EFDFD7-93C7-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> <8AqEa.3079$0d7.89727@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1417 Lines: 30 At 10:25 11/06/2003 +0000, you wrote: >I _did_ something about it - I've lost two hours to make a good example >of how to use Doxygen with wxWindows documentation, and that addressed >_your_ particular concerned of how to write events. I did this, uploaded >to my website and posted on wx-users _4_ days ago and received _no_ >reply whatsoever (AFAICT, people started a new thread which gathered >consensus towards using some kind of tool mixture keeping the docs out >of the source). I for one did appreciate what you did, I just didn't feel qualified at this point to add to what's already been said. I saved button.h and button.html and will mail them to Vadim. Thanks, Julian ========================================================================= Julian Smart mailto:julian.smart@btopenworld.com 3 Water Street, Stamford, www.anthemion.co.uk Lincs, U.K., PE9 2NJ +44 (0)1780 765976 StoryLines: story structuring www.storylinescentral.com HelpBlocks: HTML help authoring www.helpblocks.com DialogBlocks: cross-platform dialogs www.anthemion.co.uk/dialogblocks ========================================================================= --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Wed Jun 11 13:52:41 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:52:41 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Q49h-0005N3-00 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:52:41 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h5BBqaYb005516 for ; Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:52:37 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h5BBqaNQ029390 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:52:36 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h5BBqaFF029389 (8.12.9/1.3); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:52:36 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h5BBqZNQ029375 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:52:35 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 1586 invoked by uid 43863); 11 Jun 2003 11:52:20 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 1579 invoked from network); 11 Jun 2003 11:52:20 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:51:00 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[14]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <15EFDFD7-93C7-11D7-87BF-000393CB1C86@tulane.edu> <8AqEa.3079$0d7.89727@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> <7sDFa.7835$0d7.229802@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> In-Reply-To: <7sDFa.7835$0d7.229802@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h5BBqaYb005516 Status: RO Content-Length: 952 Lines: 25 On Wed, 11 Jun 2003 10:25:07 GMT Jos=E9 Fonseca = wrote: JF> I _did_ something about it - I've lost two hours to make a good examp= le JF> of how to use Doxygen with wxWindows documentation, and that addresse= d JF> _your_ particular concerned of how to write events. I did this, uploa= ded JF> to my website and posted on wx-users _4_ days ago and received _no_ JF> reply whatsoever It wasn't due to lack of interest. I simply took 3 days off and was without network access during these days. It must have been the first tim= e I stayed offline for so long during the last 3 years so I understand that it might be a bit unexpected but I think everybody can have a break from wxWindows once for a while -- even me. VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Jun 08 01:39:22 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 01:39:22 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19OnHO-0001US-00 for ; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 01:39:22 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h57NdIw0015620 for ; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:39:18 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h57NdHgS016201 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:39:17 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h57NdHjh016200 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:39:17 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h57NdHgS016190 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 8 Jun 2003 01:39:17 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 19788 invoked by uid 43863); 7 Jun 2003 23:39:02 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 19773 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2003 23:39:01 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 19:38:58 -0400 Subject: Re: Re[10]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: David Elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <360D9486-9941-11D7-ABCD-0030658FC962@stcnet.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1207 Lines: 36 On Saturday, June 7, 2003, at 08:36 AM, Vadim Zeitlin wrote: > On Tue, 03 Jun 2003 13:26:47 GMT Jos=E9 Fonseca=20 > wrote: > > JF> - You're writing techinal reference documentation. Not a book = about > JF> wxWindows. > > No, we're writing a combination of both. If we could separate the=20 > docs in > the "manual" and "reference" part, it would be different. We can't=20 > because > we don't have enough time to maintain both and also because it is=20 > going to > be far more complicated. > I'd actually prefer that we didn't separate the manual and reference=20 parts as I believe the combination is one of the biggest strengths of=20 the wxWindows documentation. When learning wxWindows I found it quite=20= useful that the topic overviews flowed very nicely with the reference=20 documentation. > JF> seperate what you have in a User Manual and a Reference Manual. > > Who is going to spend twice as much time maintaining both of them? > The tooth fairy. -Dave --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 00:17:51 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 00:17:51 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Mxcl-0001XX-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 00:17:51 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h52MGq5Y006508 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:17:47 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h52MGqgS007182 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:16:52 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h52MGqOK007181 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:16:52 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h52MGpgS007169 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:16:52 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 836 invoked by uid 43863); 2 Jun 2003 22:16:35 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 829 invoked from network); 2 Jun 2003 22:16:35 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 00:15:23 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[6]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030530180104.0404ec78@mail.btinternet.com> In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.9 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1698 Lines: 41 On Sat, 31 May 2003 01:45:25 +0200 Giuseppe Bilotta wrote: GB> > First of all, I'd like to know which problems did you encounter with LaTeX GB> > 2e. Hopefully it was something trivial in which case we wouldn't need to GB> > change TeX2RTF at all. Otherwise I'm afraid I simply don't have time to GB> > spend on this. GB> GB> There are three things that need to be done to bring the doc to GB> LaTeX2e level: GB> GB> (1) upgrade the syntax of the intro: \documentclass + \usepackage GB> instead of \documentstyle; GB> (2) upgrade to non-obsolete packages (like fancyhdr instead of GB> fancyheadings); GB> (3) fix compilation problems (like verbatim commands/environments GB> inside other commands); GB> (4) "restore" the use of colors and hyperlinks for the pdfLaTeX GB> production step; GB> GB> those which migth introduce compatibility issues with tex2rtf are, GB> IMO, (1) and (4); (1) shouldn't be a big problem, it's just a "cosmetic" change. GB> (2) should have little effect, for what I could GB> see, since fancyhdr seems to support the old-style fancyheadings GB> commands, and (3) is more likely to help both the LaTeX and the GB> tex2rtf processing phase. I will have to study the tex2rtf behaviour GB> to see how would (1) and (4) affect it. I don't quite understand what (4) is? But, anyhow, I probably won't be able to help you as I don't know tex2rtf code well and I hardly have any time to study it now... Good luck nevertheless! VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 11:22:00 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 11:22:00 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19N7zT-0004Dh-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 11:22:00 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h539LtoU022560 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:21:55 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h539LsgS029174 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:21:54 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h539LsAg029173 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:21:54 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h539LrgS029158 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:21:54 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 12307 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 09:21:34 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 12300 invoked by uid 509); 3 Jun 2003 09:21:34 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Tue Jun 03 09:21:33 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!uio.no!193.75.75.20.MISMATCH!news.eunet.no!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!oblomov.dipmat.unict.IT!not-for-mail From: Giuseppe Bilotta Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows Subject: Re: Re[6]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 11:17:37 +0200 Organization: Bilotta Message-ID: References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030530180104.0404ec78@mail.btinternet.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: oblomov.dipmat.unict.it (151.97.252.27) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1054631872 9944547 151.97.252.27 (16 [156467]) X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.60 Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25247 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.9 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, SIGNATURE_LONG_SPARSE version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h539LtoU022560 Status: RO Content-Length: 2068 Lines: 44 Vadim Zeitlin wrote: > GB> (1) upgrade the syntax of the intro: \documentclass + \usepackage=20 > GB> instead of \documentstyle; > GB> (2) upgrade to non-obsolete packages (like fancyhdr instead of=20 > GB> fancyheadings); > GB> (3) fix compilation problems (like verbatim commands/environments=20 > GB> inside other commands); > GB> (4) "restore" the use of colors and hyperlinks for the pdfLaTeX=20 > GB> production step; > GB>=20 > GB> those which migth introduce compatibility issues with tex2rtf are,=20 > GB> IMO, (1) and (4); >=20 > (1) shouldn't be a big problem, it's just a "cosmetic" change. Uh, not really. When I started testing it, the new packages seems to=20 be a little less fault-tolerant (esp. wrt verbatim code inside other=20 commands). Anyway, yes, it shouldn't be too much work. > GB> (2) should have little effect, for what I could=20 > GB> see, since fancyhdr seems to support the old-style fancyheadings=20 > GB> commands, and (3) is more likely to help both the LaTeX and the=20 > GB> tex2rtf processing phase. I will have to study the tex2rtf behaviou= r=20 > GB> to see how would (1) and (4) affect it. >=20 > I don't quite understand what (4) is? But, anyhow, I probably won't be > able to help you as I don't know tex2rtf code well and I hardly have an= y > time to study it now... The documentation makes use of a custom style, which disables all=20 colors in the documentation when processing through LaTeX (asserting=20 in the comments that LaTeX does not support color ...) Now I don't=20 know whether color was supported in old LaTeXs, it surely is in=20 modern ones. Again, this is just another cosmetic change (even less=20 than (1)). --=20 Giuseppe "Oblomov" Bilotta "Da grande lotter=F2 per la pace" "A me me la compra il mio babbo" (Altan) ("When I grow up, I will fight for peace" "My daddy will buy it for me") --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 12:47:29 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 12:47:29 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19N9KC-0004Xp-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 12:47:29 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h53AlOoU024081 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:47:24 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h53AlNgS004350 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:47:23 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h53AlNpR004349 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:47:23 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h53AlMgS004336 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:47:23 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 3666 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 10:47:04 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 3657 invoked by uid 509); 3 Jun 2003 10:47:03 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Tue Jun 03 10:47:03 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!newsfeed1.uni2.dk!skynet.be!skynet.be!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!oblomov.dipmat.unict.IT!not-for-mail From: Giuseppe Bilotta Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows Subject: Re: Re[6]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 12:45:39 +0200 Organization: Bilotta Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: oblomov.dipmat.unict.it (151.97.252.27) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1054637147 10237212 151.97.252.27 (16 [156467]) X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.60 Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25253 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.9 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, SIGNATURE_LONG_SPARSE version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h53AlOoU024081 Status: RO Content-Length: 1683 Lines: 35 Giuseppe Bilotta wrote: > Vadim Zeitlin wrote: > > Anyhow, you've started by asking one important question but I think = there > > is another just as important one: what exactly is wrong with the curr= ent > > system? To be honest, I don't see anything which couldn't be correcte= d with > > much less effort than switching to a new system. >=20 > The problem with the current system is that it's getting obsolete, at=20 > least on the LaTeX side: not to say that LaTeX itself is getting=20 > obsolete, but that LaTeX 2.09 is, and a conversion to 2e (which would=20 > give us, among other things, colored hyperlinked PDFs directly form=20 > the LaTeX source) is IMO recommended. >=20 > I decided to give TeX2RTF a look to see if I can find some "a=20 > priori" potential conflicts with 2e-adapted sources. Instead (yes I'm inconsistent! ;)) I decided to give the port to 2e a=20 chance, and did it. I had to correct a few things in a couple of=20 sources (like preventing verbatim stuff from ending within the=20 argument of some other command, or a few "free" (unescaped) &s and=20 #s), and image inclusion is still an issue. Anyway, I have a 5M hyperlinked PDF with bookmarks, so it can be=20 done. Where can I submit the changes? Re. image inclusion: can we use PNG instead of BMP/GIF? --=20 Giuseppe "Oblomov" Bilotta "Da grande lotter=F2 per la pace" "A me me la compra il mio babbo" (Altan) ("When I grow up, I will fight for peace" "My daddy will buy it for me") --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 13:40:31 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 13:40:31 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19NA9X-0004eV-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 13:40:31 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h53BeQoU024816 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 13:40:27 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h53BeQgS020168 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 13:40:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h53BeQHV020167 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 13:40:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h53BePgS020151 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 13:40:25 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 16875 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 11:40:07 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 16864 invoked from network); 3 Jun 2003 11:40:06 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.1.20030603120114.037ef0c0@mail.btinternet.com> X-Sender: julian.smart@mail.btinternet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 12:05:23 +0100 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org From: Julian Smart Subject: Re: Re[6]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1862 Lines: 44 At 12:45 03/06/2003 +0200, you wrote: >Instead (yes I'm inconsistent! ;)) I decided to give the port to 2e a >chance, and did it. I had to correct a few things in a couple of >sources (like preventing verbatim stuff from ending within the >argument of some other command, or a few "free" (unescaped) &s and >#s), and image inclusion is still an issue. > >Anyway, I have a 5M hyperlinked PDF with bookmarks, so it can be >done. Where can I submit the changes? Very interesting, particularly since I no longer have the capability to do this via Tex2RTF and Word having upgraded to WinXP which is not compatible with my copy of Acrobat. I really resent being forced to upgrade, so I was planning on using a free PDF printer driver instead, and losing the links (which took many hours to generate using Acrobat anyway). Would it be possible for you to post the PDF for us to have a look at? >Re. image inclusion: can we use PNG instead of BMP/GIF? Absolutely, but we would change the Tex2RTF sources to use PNG (plus WinHelp only uses BMP). Meanwhile we can certainly have PNG duplicates if required for Latex. Thanks, Julian ========================================================================= Julian Smart mailto:julian.smart@btopenworld.com 3 Water Street, Stamford, www.anthemion.co.uk Lincs, U.K., PE9 2NJ +44 (0)1780 765976 StoryLines: story structuring www.storylinescentral.com HelpBlocks: HTML help authoring www.helpblocks.com DialogBlocks: cross-platform dialogs www.anthemion.co.uk/dialogblocks ========================================================================= --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 14:15:02 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 14:15:02 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19NAgw-0004o9-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 14:15:02 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h53CEtoU025950 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 14:14:57 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h53CEtgS029959 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 14:14:55 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h53CEtAX029958 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 14:14:55 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h53CEsgS029921 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 14:14:54 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 29926 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 12:14:34 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 29917 invoked from network); 3 Jun 2003 12:14:33 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3EDC9127.9050506@computer-surgery.co.uk> Date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 13:14:31 +0100 From: Paul Gammans User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030327 Debian/1.3-4 X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030603120114.037ef0c0@mail.btinternet.com> In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.1.20030603120114.037ef0c0@mail.btinternet.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.74.0.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-32.8 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 922 Lines: 29 Julian Smart wrote: >> Re. image inclusion: can we use PNG instead of BMP/GIF? > > Absolutely, but we would change the Tex2RTF sources to use > PNG (plus WinHelp only uses BMP). Meanwhile we can certainly > have PNG duplicates if required for Latex. > With our wxwindows projects we now starting to use ppm files and have added make file rules to generate the bmp and xpm and ico file as needed with the programs below from netpbm http://netpbm.sourceforge.net/ ppmtoxpm ppmtobmp ppmtowinicon This enables us to use one source image and generate the others as needed. Could this be extended to allow somthing simular to work for the doc's too as netpbm is available for the major platforms we support. paul --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 15:17:22 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 15:17:22 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19NBfG-0004xM-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 15:17:22 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h53DHHoU026974 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:17:18 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h53DDWgS017535 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:13:32 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h53DDWcg017534 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:13:32 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h53DDVgS017520 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:13:32 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 17829 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 13:13:00 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 17822 invoked by uid 509); 3 Jun 2003 13:13:00 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Tue Jun 03 13:13:00 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!news.eunet.no!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!ppp-145-130.29-151.libero.IT!not-for-mail From: Giuseppe Bilotta Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows Subject: Re: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:11:12 +0200 Organization: Bilotta Message-ID: References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030603120114.037ef0c0@mail.btinternet.com> <3EDC9127.9050506@computer-surgery.co.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-145-130.29-151.libero.it (151.29.130.145) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1054645882 10198312 151.29.130.145 (16 [156467]) X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.60 Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25265 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.9 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, SIGNATURE_LONG_SPARSE version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h53DHHoU026974 Status: RO Content-Length: 1309 Lines: 34 Paul Gammans wrote: > Julian Smart wrote: >=20 > >> Re. image inclusion: can we use PNG instead of BMP/GIF? > > > > Absolutely, but we would change the Tex2RTF sources to use > > PNG (plus WinHelp only uses BMP). Meanwhile we can certainly > > have PNG duplicates if required for Latex. > >=20 >=20 > With our wxwindows projects we now starting to use ppm files and have=20 > added make file rules to generate the bmp and xpm and ico file as neede= d=20 > with the programs below from netpbm http://netpbm.sourceforge.net/ >=20 > ppmtoxpm > ppmtobmp > ppmtowinicon >=20 > This enables us to use one source image and generate the others as need= ed. >=20 > Could this be extended to allow somthing simular to work for the doc's=20 > too as netpbm is available for the major platforms we support. These formats are of course good for bitmapped images. Am I right in=20 assuming no vector graphics is used in the wx doc? --=20 Giuseppe "Oblomov" Bilotta "Da grande lotter=F2 per la pace" "A me me la compra il mio babbo" (Altan) ("When I grow up, I will fight for peace" "My daddy will buy it for me") --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue Jun 03 15:09:13 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 03 Jun 2003 15:09:13 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19NBXN-0004w7-00 for ; Tue, 03 Jun 2003 15:09:13 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h53D99oU026808 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:09:09 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h53D99gS016589 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:09:09 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h53D98L9016588 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:09:08 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h53D97gS016575 (8.12.9/3.58); Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:09:08 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 15740 invoked by uid 43863); 3 Jun 2003 13:07:57 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 15728 invoked by uid 509); 3 Jun 2003 13:07:57 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Tue Jun 03 13:07:56 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!news-FFM2.ecrc.net!newsfeed.vmunix.org!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!ppp-145-130.29-151.libero.IT!not-for-mail From: Giuseppe Bilotta Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows Subject: Re: Re[6]: Documentation for wx(Windows|Python|Perl|Whatever) Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 15:07:27 +0200 Organization: Bilotta Message-ID: References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030603120114.037ef0c0@mail.btinternet.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-145-130.29-151.libero.it (151.29.130.145) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1054645658 10198312 151.29.130.145 (16 [156467]) X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.60 Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:25264 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.9 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, SIGNATURE_LONG_SPARSE version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by elektron.atoom.net id h53D99oU026808 Status: RO Content-Length: 1925 Lines: 44 Julian Smart wrote: > >Anyway, I have a 5M hyperlinked PDF with bookmarks, so it can be > >done. Where can I submit the changes? >=20 > Very interesting, particularly since I no longer have the > capability to do this via Tex2RTF and Word having > upgraded to WinXP which is not compatible with my > copy of Acrobat. I really resent being forced to upgrade, > so I was planning on using a free PDF printer driver > instead, and losing the links (which took many hours > to generate using Acrobat anyway). Well, there would be other options to generate hyperlinked PDF; one=20 could for example be WordPerfect 10 or 11: it can read RTF and it can=20 export to PDF, with hyperlinks (not sure if it can generate bookmarks=20 too); also, OpenOffice.org 1.1 will include an export-to-PDF too; I'm=20 not sure it would support hyperlinks in its first incarnation, though=20 (it doesn't yet). > Would it be possible for you to post the PDF for us > to have a look at? As I said, it's some 5Mb, which is pretty big; being on dial-up most=20 of the time, I might have problems uploading it. Anyway, I submitted=20 a set of patches to SF. Anybody with a recent enough LaTeX=20 distribution can create it from the patched sources. > >Re. image inclusion: can we use PNG instead of BMP/GIF? >=20 > Absolutely, but we would change the Tex2RTF sources to use > PNG (plus WinHelp only uses BMP). Meanwhile we can certainly > have PNG duplicates if required for Latex. I see that the distribution includes some GIFs; what are they needed=20 for? --=20 Giuseppe "Oblomov" Bilotta "Da grande lotter=F2 per la pace" "A me me la compra il mio babbo" (Altan) ("When I grow up, I will fight for peace" "My daddy will buy it for me") --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat May 24 21:50:53 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 24 May 2003 21:50:53 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Jf2Y-00086r-00 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 21:50:52 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4OJohxY008770 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 21:50:46 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4OJoh0P025011 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 21:50:43 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4OJohtY025009 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 24 May 2003 21:50:43 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4OJog0P024996 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 21:50:42 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 14655 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 19:50:37 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 14644 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 19:50:36 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <000f01c3222f$98539e50$0100a8c0@gm> From: "Graciliano M. P. \(Virtua Sites\)" To: References: Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 17:03:48 -0300 Organization: Virtua Sites MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [wx-dev] XML reference of wxWindows classes? X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-7.2 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 612 Lines: 18 There is a XML reference of all the wxWindows classes/objects? I want some database with the classes and their methods (and arguments), constants, events, etc... Or some one know how to build this? Maybe this can be very important for future versions of wxWindows, since you can see "now" a lot of projects linking wxWindows with interpreters, like wxPerl, wx4J, wxPython, and the list grow... Regards, GMP. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat May 24 22:20:15 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 24 May 2003 22:20:15 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19JfV0-0008CR-00 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:20:15 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4OKKAxY009254 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:20:11 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4OKGQ0P026957 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:16:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4OKGQ0m026956 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:16:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4OKGP0P026944 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:16:25 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 26659 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 20:16:19 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 26647 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 20:16:18 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <002101c32231$5bd69fc0$15b30250@bob> From: "William Manley" To: References: <000f01c3222f$98539e50$0100a8c0@gm> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 21:16:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Subject: Re: [wx-dev] XML reference of wxWindows classes? X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.5 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 492 Lines: 16 > There is a XML reference of all the wxWindows classes/objects? Not that I know of > I want some database with the classes and their methods (and arguments), > constants, events, etc... > > Or some one know how to build this? Doxygen could generate it www.doxygen.org. HTH William Manley --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat May 24 22:40:14 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 24 May 2003 22:40:14 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19JfoM-0008Fn-00 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:40:14 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4OKeAxY009529 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:40:10 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4OKeA0P028995 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:40:10 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4OKeAKP028994 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:40:10 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4OKe90P028979 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:40:09 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 10262 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 20:40:03 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 10250 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 20:40:03 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 22:20:57 +0200 From: Arnout Engelen To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Message-ID: <20030524202057.GD9991@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> References: <000f01c3222f$98539e50$0100a8c0@gm> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Security: MIME headers sanitized on wn1 See http://www.impsec.org/email-tools/sanitizer-intro.html for details. $Revision: 1.136 $Date: 2002-10-20 10:38:14-07 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="ibTvN161/egqYuK8" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <000f01c3222f$98539e50$0100a8c0@gm> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Face: +5<4p=wAw9CfJeb1)}#72dL9Kz#0|wnyTLORn(~.;+B3?(:8HXkA^9yzF/aHD/p~Ge]GlYyLtI3+U<""hFLN3JH}}n= Subject: Re: [wx-dev] XML reference of wxWindows classes? X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-33.4 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 5767 Lines: 102 --ibTvN161/egqYuK8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline On Sat, May 24, 2003 at 05:03:48PM -0300, Graciliano M. P. (Virtua Sites) wrote: > There is a XML reference of all the wxWindows classes/objects? not that I know of > I want some database with the classes and their methods (and arguments), > constants, events, etc... > > Or some one know how to build this? Shouldn't be too hard to generate such a thing from the online docs: check out the attached perl code I used for wxGuru (the bot in #wxwindows) to parse those. Tell me if it's hard to understand, I should probably add some comments here and there. > Maybe this can be very important for future versions of wxWindows, since you > can see "now" a lot of projects linking wxWindows with interpreters, like > wxPerl, wx4J, wxPython, and the list grow... don't see exactly why you'd need an xml reference for that Regards, Arnout --ibTvN161/egqYuK8 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="classinfo.28993DEFANGED-pl" X-Content-Security: [wn1] original Content-Type was application/x-perl Content-Type: application/octet-stream; Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable #!/usr/bin/perl=0A=0Aunshift (@INC, ("/usr/home/arnouten/perllib"));=0A=0Au= se LWP::Simple;=0A=0A$|++;=0A=0A#$base =3D "http://www.lpthe.jussieu.fr/~ze= itlin/wxWindows/docs";=0A$base =3D "http://www.wxwindows.org/manuals/2.4.0"= ;=0A=0A# Collects data about the classes=0Asub collectUrls=0A{=0A # TODO d= on't hardcode '26'=0A my $pagina =3D get("$base/wx26.htm#classref")=0A = || die "couldn't open page $base/wx26.htm#classref: $!\n";=0A=0A print LOG= "Reading class info";=0A=0A while ($pagina =3D~ /HREF=3D"([^"]*)">([^<= ]*)/g)=0A {=0A print LOG ".";=0A my $url =3D $1;=0A my $name =3D = lc($2);=0A $classurl{$name} =3D $url;=0A print "$name has $url\n";=0A= }=0A print LOG " done\n";=0A}=0A=0Asub wipeCache=0A{=0A foreach $key (k= eys %classurl)=0A { delete $classurl{$key}; }=0A=0A foreach $key (keys %c= lassinfo)=0A { delete $classinfo{$key}; }=0A =0A collectUrls();=0A}=0A= =0Asub getClassInfo=0A{=0A my ($name) =3D @_;=0A $name =3D lc($name);=0A = print "Name: $name\n";=0A=0A if (!defined $classinfo{$name})=0A {=0A = print LOG "Class information for $name not cached, retrieving from www\n";= =0A if (! ($classinfo{$name} =3D get("$base/$classurl{$name}")))=0A {= =0A sndtxt "Couldn't get $base/$classurl{$name}: $!\n";=0A $class= info{$name} =3D "";=0A }=0A }=0A=0A return $classinfo{$name};=0A}=0A= =0Asub getDescription=0A{=0A my ($name) =3D @_;=0A=0A my $info =3D getCla= ssInfo($name);=0A =0A $info =3D~ /

    $name(.*?)", $info);=0A=0A my @lines =3D ();=0A=0A foreach $line (@tmplines)= =0A {=0A $line =3D~ s/<[^>]*>//g;=0A $line =3D~ s/\n/ /g;=0A=0A i= f (! ($line =3D~ /^\s*$/))=0A {=0A @lines =3D ($line, @lines);=0A = }=0A }=0A return @lines;=0A}=0A=0Asub getSection=0A{=0A my ($class, $s= ection) =3D @_;=0A=0A my $info =3D getClassInfo($class);=0A=0A $info =3D~= />$section<\/FONT><\/B>

    \n(.*?)([^<]*)/g)=0A {=0A @parents =3D (@parents, $1);=0A }=0A return @pa= rents;=0A}=0A=0Asub getIncludes=0A{=0A my ($class, $func) =3D @_;=0A=0A m= y @includes;=0A=0A my $info =3D getSection($class, "Include file")=0A |= | return "No such class or section for class $class";=0A=0A while ($info = =3D~ /<(.*?)>/g)=0A {=0A @includes =3D (@includes, $1);=0A }=0A = return @includes;=0A}=0A=0Asub getFuncDescr=0A{=0A my ($class, $func) =3D= @_;=0A=0A my $info =3D getClassInfo($class);=0A=0A if ($info =3D~ /

    $= class\:\:$func<\/H3>\n

    .*?

    \n(.*?)

    /s)=0A {=0A my $descr =3D $1;= =0A return $descr;=0A }=0A return "No description found for $func in $= class."=0A}=0A=0Asub getType=0A{=0A my ($class, $func) =3D @_;=0A=0A my $= info =3D getClassInfo($class);=0A=0A if ($info =3D~ /

    $class\:\:$func<\= /H3>\n

    \n(.*)

    /)=0A {=0A my $type =3D $1;=0A $type =3D~ s//= =02/g;=0A $type =3D~ s/<\/B>/=02/g;=0A $type =3D~ s//=02/g;=0A = $type =3D~ s/<\/TT>/=02/g;=0A $type =3D~ s/ / =1F/g;=0A $type =3D= ~ s/<\/I>/=1F/g;=0A $type =3D~ s/&/&/g;=0A return "$type (class $= class)";=0A }=0A else=0A {=0A my @parents =3D getParentClasses($class= );=0A my $type;=0A=0A foreach $parent (@parents)=0A {=0A if (= $parent ne "No such class or section")=0A {=0A $type =3D getTyp= e($parent, $func);=0A if ($type ne "No such method, '$func'")=0A = {=0A return $type;=0A }=0A }=0A }=0A return = "No such method, '$func'";=0A }=0A}=0A=0AcollectUrls();=0A=0A# for testing= purposes:=0A#print "site for wxString: $classurl{wxString}\n";=0A#$desc = =3D getDescription("wxString");=0A#print "description: $desc\n";=0A#=0A#my = $bmtype =3D getType ("wxFrame", "Show");=0A#print "type for wxFrame::Show: = $bmtype\n";=0A#my @classes;=0A#@classes =3D getParentClasses("wxSizer");=0A= #foreach $class (@classes)=0A#{=0A# print "Class: $class\n";=0A#}=0A=0A1;= =0A --ibTvN161/egqYuK8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org --ibTvN161/egqYuK8-- From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat May 24 22:58:16 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 24 May 2003 22:58:16 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Jg5o-0008I2-00 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:58:16 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4OKwCxY009730 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:58:12 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4OKsR0P000020 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:54:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4OKsREh000019 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:54:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4OKsQ0P000007 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:54:26 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 16837 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 20:54:19 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 16826 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 20:54:19 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <006f01c32238$80796c20$0100a8c0@gm> From: "Graciliano M. P. \(Virtua Sites\)" To: References: <000f01c3222f$98539e50$0100a8c0@gm> <20030524202057.GD9991@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 18:07:36 -0300 Organization: Virtua Sites MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: [wx-dev] XML reference of wxWindows classes? X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.5 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 621 Lines: 18 > Shouldn't be too hard to generate such a thing from the online docs: > > check out the attached perl code I used for wxGuru (the bot in > #wxwindows) to parse those. Tell me if it's hard to understand, I should > probably add some comments here and there. Will turn it into a Perl module. Maybe the best option is to get this from DOCs! I have tested Doxigen and the output is to far from what I want. Regards, GMP. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat May 24 22:40:21 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 24 May 2003 22:40:21 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19JfoT-0008Fz-00 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:40:21 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4OKeIxY009547 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:40:19 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4OKeI0P029013 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:40:18 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4OKeI6J029012 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:40:18 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4OKeH0P028999 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:40:18 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 10616 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 20:40:11 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 10605 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 20:40:11 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3ECFD9E4.5030705@lehigh.edu> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 16:45:24 -0400 From: John Labenski Reply-To: jrl1@Lehigh.EDU User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.3.1) Gecko/20030428 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [wx-dev] Re: XML reference of wxWindows classes? X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.4 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1224 Lines: 37 >> Or some one know how to build this? >Doxygen could generate it www.doxygen.org. How? I don't see any way to generate a pure list of classes, funtions, enums, etc. It seems to only be able to generate HTML and TeX. I've been fooling with ctags (exuberant ctags that is), get the newest version from ctags.sourceforge.net since if you use Linux you might have some bastardized version that comes with emacs. ./ctags-5.5/bin/ctags \ -u \ --fields=afikmsSz \ --c-types=cdefgmstuv \ --c++-types=cmefgmstu gdicmn.h Then you get lines like this in your tags file that you can parse with awk or something else GetX gdicmn.h /^ int GetX() const { return x; }$/;" kind:f class:wxRect access:public signature:() const or this Intersect gdicmn.h /^ wxRect Intersect(const wxRect& rect) const$/;" kind:f class:wxRect access:public signature:(const wxRect& rect) Note that the options I use above are probably not optimal, just something I was fooling with. -John Labenski --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat May 24 22:49:23 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 24 May 2003 22:49:23 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19JfxD-0008H7-00 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:49:23 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4OKnJxY009642 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:49:19 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4OKnI0P029557 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:49:18 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4OKnItB029556 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:49:18 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4OKnH0P029544 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:49:18 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 14843 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 20:49:12 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 14832 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 20:49:12 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3ECFDAE6.7090902@xs4all.nl> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 22:49:42 +0200 From: Klaas Holwerda User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org References: <3ECFD9E4.5030705@lehigh.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [wx-dev] Re: XML reference of wxWindows classes? X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-29.5 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 857 Lines: 31 John Labenski wrote: > >> Or some one know how to build this? > >Doxygen could generate it www.doxygen.org. > > How? I don't see any way to generate a pure list of classes, funtions, > enums, etc. It seems to only be able to generate HTML and TeX. Is this a question?? # If the GENERATE_XML tag is set to YES Doxygen will # generate an XML file that captures the structure of # the code including all documentation. Warning: This feature # is still experimental and very incomplete. GENERATE_XML = YES I get XML, you don't? Next some XSLT trickery, and you can get anything you want. I had/ maybe have some simple XSL scripts . Klaas --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun May 18 14:47:20 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 18 May 2003 14:47:20 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19HNZP-00019t-00 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 14:47:20 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4IClFuI024976 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 14:47:15 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4IChUs8005226 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 18 May 2003 14:43:30 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4IChUuK005225 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 18 May 2003 14:43:30 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4IChTs8005210 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 18 May 2003 14:43:29 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 22202 invoked by uid 43863); 18 May 2003 12:43:21 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 22191 invoked from network); 18 May 2003 12:43:20 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <008f01c31d3b$12cbfbe0$15b30250@bob> From: "William Manley" To: Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 13:43:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Security: MIME headers sanitized on wn1 See http://www.impsec.org/email-tools/sanitizer-intro.html for details. $Revision: 1.136 $Date: 2002-10-20 10:38:14-07 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_008C_01C31D43.73E86410" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Subject: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.6 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 585 Lines: 22 ------=_NextPart_000_008C_01C31D43.73E86410 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have pretty much finished the conversion to an xsl based website, so = I'm thinking about making it so others can edit the website under the = new system so I have a questionaire for those of you who wish to be able = to edit the website. What Operating systems are you running? Which of the following do you have installed: o Perl o Java o Python That's it, Thanks for your time William Manley ------=_NextPart_000_008C_01C31D43.73E86410-- From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun May 18 15:43:59 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 18 May 2003 15:43:59 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19HOSF-0001HK-00 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 15:43:59 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4IDhtuI025660 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 15:43:55 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4IDeAs8009564 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 18 May 2003 15:40:10 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4IDeAZe009563 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 18 May 2003 15:40:10 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4IDe8s8009546 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 18 May 2003 15:40:09 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 16235 invoked by uid 43863); 18 May 2003 13:40:00 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 16221 invoked from network); 18 May 2003 13:40:00 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.1.20030518143910.03cf3870@mail.btinternet.com> X-Sender: julian.smart@mail.btinternet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 14:39:56 +0100 To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org From: Julian Smart In-Reply-To: <008f01c31d3b$12cbfbe0$15b30250@bob> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: Re: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.5 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1185 Lines: 32 At 13:43 18/05/2003 +0100, you wrote: >I have pretty much finished the conversion to an xsl based website, so I'm >thinking about making it so others can edit the website under the new >system so I have a questionaire for those of you who wish to be able to >edit the website. > >What Operating systems are you running? > > >Which of the following do you have installed: >o Perl >o Java >o Python Thanks -- main environment is Windows XP, Java, can install Python or Perl if required. Regards, Julian ========================================================================= Julian Smart mailto:julian.smart@btopenworld.com 3 Water Street, Stamford, http://www.anthemion.co.uk Lincs, U.K., PE9 2NJ +44 (0)1780 765976 StoryLines: an intuitive writing tool http://www.storylinescentral.com HelpBlocks: easy HTML help authoring http://www.helpblocks.com ======================================================================== --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri May 23 00:53:22 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 23 May 2003 00:53:22 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Iyw6-0006gN-00 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 00:53:22 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4MMrIKX026950 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 00:53:18 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4MMrI0P004225 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 23 May 2003 00:53:18 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4MMrHiL004224 (8.12.9/1.3); Fri, 23 May 2003 00:53:17 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4MMrH0P004212 (8.12.9/3.58); Fri, 23 May 2003 00:53:17 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 12021 invoked by uid 43863); 22 May 2003 22:53:10 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 12010 invoked from network); 22 May 2003 22:53:10 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 00:52:10 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030518143910.03cf3870@mail.btinternet.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030522201831.030a4780@mail.btinternet.com> <01cb01c320ab$1cb0a160$15b30250@bob> In-Reply-To: <01cb01c320ab$1cb0a160$15b30250@bob> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: Subject: Re[2]: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1724 Lines: 42 On Thu, 22 May 2003 22:42:56 +0100 William Manley wrote: WM> I have been integrating the changes as you have been changing the website WM> (adding news items, the wxShop page), but I understand your position. The WM> thing I'm worried about is that mabey if it's not uploaded soon it will WM> become more difficult keeping it in sync with the current website all the WM> work would have have to be done again True. Maintaining 2 in parallel is unworkable. WM> So the system is basically the same: WM> WM> o Old system: write html, new system: write html (with optional other stuff WM> which doesn't need to be learnt with any speed, but in the long run would WM> save you time) What is it? WM> o Old system: run make, new system: run .bat file I strongly dislike it. What was wrong with make? WM> You could just leave the updates to me until you have less on WM> your plate of course, but that would require you entrusting me with CVS WM> write access to the wxWebsite module (somthing you may or may not want to WM> do). I suppose this is the only workable solution. But before replacing the old files with the new ones I'd really like to see better what do we gain from it. I did have a look at your new site and there were some things which I liked in it (and, as usual, some which I didn't). But I'm not speaking about it here: it's clear that minor tweaks could be done without changing everything. So, once again, what is the compelling reason to change web site? Thanks, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat May 24 14:38:45 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 24 May 2003 14:38:45 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19JYIO-00073I-00 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:38:45 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4OCccxY003201 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:38:41 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4OCYr0P015027 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 14:34:53 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4OCYrxp015026 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 24 May 2003 14:34:53 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4OCYq0P015014 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 14:34:53 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 23465 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 12:34:44 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 23444 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 12:34:44 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <011b01c321f0$e0b08bc0$15b30250@bob> From: "William Manley" To: References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030518143910.03cf3870@mail.btinternet.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030522201831.030a4780@mail.btinternet.com> <01cb01c320ab$1cb0a160$15b30250@bob> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 13:34:52 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Subject: Re: Re[2]: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.5 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2641 Lines: 62 > WM> So the system is basically the same: > WM> > WM> o Old system: write html, new system: write html (with optional other stuff > WM> which doesn't need to be learnt with any speed, but in the long run would > WM> save you time) > > What is it? > > WM> o Old system: run make, new system: run .bat file > > I strongly dislike it. What was wrong with make? I didn't like the dependancy on make, but I have come up with a better idea. I have a list of files in an xml document, and through some xsl I can get the xslt engine to convert each file in turn, so the only dependancy is an xsl processor. This has the added bonus of being faster as the xsl doesn't have to be loaded each time. I have found a xsl processor written in C (xalan-C) so dependancys on interpreted languages is removed > WM> You could just leave the updates to me until you have less on > WM> your plate of course, but that would require you entrusting me with CVS > WM> write access to the wxWebsite module (somthing you may or may not want to > WM> do). > > I suppose this is the only workable solution. But before replacing the old > files with the new ones I'd really like to see better what do we gain from > it. I did have a look at your new site and there were some things which I > liked in it (and, as usual, some which I didn't). But I'm not speaking > about it here: it's clear that minor tweaks could be done without changing > everything. So, once again, what is the compelling reason to change web > site? The biggest reason is what could be done in the future. IMO c++ pre-processor is not suitable for a growing website the size of ours. I havn't made any major changes, mainly just converting from the old system to a new one, to open up a whole host of new oppertunities in the future. I have added a few time saving things: o All the news being contained on one page, and other pages which want to display it, just say that they want to with an xml tag o All the screenshots bieng contained on a single page, and multiple screenshot pages being generated from that o New tags for ease of writing articles separating content from format The major reason I converted the website is so it could be more effectivley worked on in the future, I wanted to work on the website, but before I could I thaught some architectural changes were nessacary so I implemented them. The cool stuff comes later, but the ground work is done. William Manley --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat May 24 20:10:57 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 24 May 2003 20:10:57 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19JdTt-0007tG-00 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 20:10:57 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4OIApxY007251 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 20:10:53 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4OI760P016162 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 20:07:06 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4OI760I016161 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 24 May 2003 20:07:06 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4OI750P016149 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 20:07:06 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 1684 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 18:06:59 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 1667 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 18:06:58 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3ECFB4C0.2030009@treyarch.com> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 11:06:56 -0700 From: Wade Brainerd User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030313 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030518143910.03cf3870@mail.btinternet.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030522201831.030a4780@mail.btinternet.com> <01cb01c320ab$1cb0a160$15b30250@bob> <011b01c321f0$e0b08bc0$15b30250@bob> In-Reply-To: <011b01c321f0$e0b08bc0$15b30250@bob> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-16.9 required=5.5 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCES, USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1151 Lines: 28 > > >I didn't like the dependancy on make, but I have come up with a better idea. >I have a list of files in an xml document, and through some xsl I can get >the xslt engine to convert each file in turn, so the only dependancy is an >xsl processor. This has the added bonus of being faster as the xsl doesn't >have to be loaded each time. > >I have found a xsl processor written in C (xalan-C) so dependancys on >interpreted languages is removed > > I wanted to add that XSL is a very powerful way to 'compile' web pages. The example that turned me on to it was Joseph Jude's FotosOnWeb application, posted to the list earlier. Take a look at his photo album templates to see what can be done. I can see definite advantages to going with something that powerful, versus things like scripts and the C preprocessor. Even if it doesn't immediately add to the functionality or ease of use of the web site, it is a definite step forward. Wade --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat May 24 22:20:51 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 24 May 2003 22:20:51 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19JfVb-0008Cf-00 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:20:51 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4OKKlxY009263 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:20:47 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4OKKl0P027300 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:20:47 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4OKKl1U027299 (8.12.9/1.3); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:20:47 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4OKKk0P027287 (8.12.9/3.58); Sat, 24 May 2003 22:20:46 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 28497 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 20:20:40 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 28485 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 20:20:40 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <3ECFD436.6050402@xs4all.nl> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 22:21:10 +0200 From: Klaas Holwerda User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030518143910.03cf3870@mail.btinternet.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030522201831.030a4780@mail.btinternet.com> <01cb01c320ab$1cb0a160$15b30250@bob> <011b01c321f0$e0b08bc0$15b30250@bob> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-19.6 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UA version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 654 Lines: 25 William Manley wrote: > >I have found a xsl processor written in C (xalan-C) so dependancys on >interpreted languages is removed > I always use instant saxon, which comes as an executable also. But is xalan works, why not. And to support you, indeed many things can be done easily with XLS, and maintenance will be easier in the end. But all beginning is hard ;-) Using Docbook myself, i understand that XSLT is really powerfull. Thanks, Klaas --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun May 25 01:09:19 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 25 May 2003 01:09:19 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Ji8d-00018U-00 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 01:09:19 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4ON9FxY015582 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 01:09:15 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4ON9E0P009782 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 25 May 2003 01:09:14 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4ON9EOC009781 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 25 May 2003 01:09:14 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4ON9D0P009769 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 25 May 2003 01:09:14 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 17278 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 23:09:08 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 17267 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 23:09:08 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <008601c32249$81776b70$15b30250@bob> From: "William Manley" To: References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030518143910.03cf3870@mail.btinternet.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030522201831.030a4780@mail.btinternet.com> <01cb01c320ab$1cb0a160$15b30250@bob> <011b01c321f0$e0b08bc0$15b30250@bob> <3ECFD436.6050402@xs4all.nl> Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 00:09:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Subject: Re: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.5 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 743 Lines: 21 > >I have found a xsl processor written in C (xalan-C) so dependancys on > >interpreted languages is removed > > > I always use instant saxon, which comes as an executable also. > But is xalan works, why not. The problem with instant saxon (which personally I prefer) is the dependancy on java, even when built as an exe there is still the dependancy AFAIK > And to support you, indeed many things can be done easily with XLS, and > maintenance > will be easier in the end. But all beginning is hard ;-) What is hard? Thanks William Manley --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun May 25 00:57:23 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 25 May 2003 00:57:23 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Jhx5-0000AE-00 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 00:57:23 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4OMvJxY011440 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 00:57:19 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4OMrY0P008725 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 25 May 2003 00:53:34 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4OMrYYE008724 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 25 May 2003 00:53:34 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4OMrX0P008712 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 25 May 2003 00:53:33 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 9626 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 22:53:28 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 9615 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 22:53:27 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 00:52:26 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030518143910.03cf3870@mail.btinternet.com> <5.0.2.1.1.20030522201831.030a4780@mail.btinternet.com> <01cb01c320ab$1cb0a160$15b30250@bob> <011b01c321f0$e0b08bc0$15b30250@bob> In-Reply-To: <011b01c321f0$e0b08bc0$15b30250@bob> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: Subject: Re[4]: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1739 Lines: 42 On Sat, 24 May 2003 13:34:52 +0100 William Manley wrote: WM> > WM> o Old system: run make, new system: run .bat file WM> > WM> > I strongly dislike it. What was wrong with make? WM> WM> I didn't like the dependancy on make, But the nice thing with make is, of course, that it only rebuilds the files affected by the changes. I.e. if I modify i18n.in only, then only i18n.htm is regenerated. How can a simple compiler/XSLT achieve this? WM> The biggest reason is what could be done in the future. IMO c++ WM> pre-processor is not suitable for a growing website the size of ours. I can't disagree with this. WM> I have added a few time saving things: WM> o All the news being contained on one page, and other pages which want to WM> display it, just say that they want to with an xml tag WM> o All the screenshots bieng contained on a single page, and multiple WM> screenshot pages being generated from that WM> o New tags for ease of writing articles separating content from format Looks nice. WM> The major reason I converted the website is so it could be more effectivley WM> worked on in the future, I wanted to work on the website, but before I could WM> I thaught some architectural changes were nessacary so I implemented them. WM> The cool stuff comes later, but the ground work is done. IMHO we should give you write access to the cvs wxWebSite module and (thankfully!) let you pursue this program but Julian and not me is doing this work now so ultimately only he can decide. Thanks, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Wed May 21 00:30:33 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Wed, 21 May 2003 00:30:33 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19IFcv-0004pE-00 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 00:30:33 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4KMUSpc032317 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 00:30:28 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4KMUS0P026831 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 21 May 2003 00:30:28 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4KMUSEm026829 (8.12.9/1.3); Wed, 21 May 2003 00:30:28 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4KMUP0P026815 (8.12.9/3.58); Wed, 21 May 2003 00:30:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 15290 invoked by uid 43863); 20 May 2003 22:30:08 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 15275 invoked from network); 20 May 2003 22:30:07 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 00:29:08 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <008f01c31d3b$12cbfbe0$15b30250@bob> In-Reply-To: <008f01c31d3b$12cbfbe0$15b30250@bob> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: Subject: Re: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 818 Lines: 25 [please set your word wrap to 75 or less, thank you] On Sun, 18 May 2003 13:43:23 +0100 William Manley wrote: WM> I have pretty much finished the conversion to an xsl based website, so WM> I'm thinking about making it so others can edit the website under the WM> new system so I have a questionaire for those of you who wish to be WM> able to edit the website. WM> WM> What Operating systems are you running? W2K/Linux/OS X mainly, too many others to mention occasionally. WM> Which of the following do you have installed: WM> o Perl WM> o Java WM> o Python Both Perl and Python. VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun May 11 22:21:34 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 11 May 2003 22:21:34 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19ExK9-0002ec-00 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 22:21:34 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.3) with ESMTP id h4BKLT99021267 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 22:21:29 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4BKLSlG023416 (8.12.9/3.57); Sun, 11 May 2003 22:21:29 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4BKLSpt023415 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 11 May 2003 22:21:28 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4BKLSlG023402 (8.12.9/3.57); Sun, 11 May 2003 22:21:28 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 28898 invoked by uid 43863); 11 May 2003 20:21:19 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 28881 invoked from network); 11 May 2003 20:21:18 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <000d01c317fa$dd6b85a0$15b30250@bob> From: "William Manley" To: Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 21:21:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Subject: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.6 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1510 Lines: 33 I've got the website into a viewable state, it looks a bit wierd as the css is referenced absolutly, so doesn't have an effect here as the website is in a sub-directory, but it looks ok when it is at the root. Sorry it took so long, I have been a bit busy and it's not finished yet, still some polishing to do, and I dont know how it would look/ is supposed to look on the cd version, but I have preserved the preprocessor macros in one form or another. The files are as follows: site/ This is the processed site source/ This is where all the files to be passed through the XSLT thingy reside static/ These files are copied streight to site without modification site.xsl The XSL file the source files were converted by doxslt.pl a perl script which creates site, etc. A better way of doing this will have to be done as it has too many dependancys and is not cross-platform so is just pants really, but I uploaded the entire directory so it's there anyway. The major changes are the screenshots, the news and the download pages. The screenshots and the download pages need a bit of polish mind. oh yeh, the address, nearly forgot http://homepage.ntlworld.com/geoff.manley/NewWeb/ Please tell me what you think William Manley --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon May 12 22:15:43 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 12 May 2003 22:15:43 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19FJi1-0000dr-00 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 22:15:43 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.3) with ESMTP id h4CKFamr026050 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 22:15:36 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4CKFarG025771 (8.12.9/3.57); Mon, 12 May 2003 22:15:36 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4CKFaPG025770 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 12 May 2003 22:15:36 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4CKFZrG025756 (8.12.9/3.57); Mon, 12 May 2003 22:15:35 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 25800 invoked by uid 43863); 12 May 2003 20:15:27 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 25778 invoked from network); 12 May 2003 20:15:27 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.1.20030512210714.03e64c58@mail.btinternet.com> X-Sender: julian.smart@mail.btinternet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 21:15:20 +0100 To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org From: Julian Smart In-Reply-To: <000d01c317fa$dd6b85a0$15b30250@bob> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: Re: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.5 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 2800 Lines: 64 Hi William, It's looking interesting. Looking at the source, I'm wondering if it'll be that much easier to write/maintain? I expect it's mainly because I haven't got the spare cycles to concentrate on it. I'll try to have another look soon. I think it's a Good Thing to consider alternatives to what we have now, and I really appreciate the effort, but I/we can't guarantee to take up even stuff that's a big improvement, just because of limited cranial capacity and time. Anyway I do appreciate the work you're put in. Thanks, Julian At 21:21 11/05/2003 +0100, you wrote: >I've got the website into a viewable state, it looks a bit wierd as the css >is referenced absolutly, so doesn't have an effect here as the website is in >a sub-directory, but it looks ok when it is at the root. Sorry it took so >long, I have been a bit busy and it's not finished yet, still some polishing >to do, and I dont know how it would look/ is supposed to look on the cd >version, but I have preserved the preprocessor macros in one form or >another. The files are as follows: > >site/ This is the processed site >source/ This is where all the files to be passed through the >XSLT thingy reside >static/ These files are copied streight to site without >modification >site.xsl The XSL file the source files were converted by >doxslt.pl a perl script which creates site, etc. A better way >of doing this will have to be done as it has too many dependancys and is not >cross-platform so is just pants really, but I uploaded the entire directory >so it's there anyway. > >The major changes are the screenshots, the news and the download pages. The >screenshots and the download pages need a bit of polish mind. > >oh yeh, the address, nearly forgot >http://homepage.ntlworld.com/geoff.manley/NewWeb/ > >Please tell me what you think > >William Manley > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org >For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org ========================================================================= Julian Smart mailto:julian.smart@btopenworld.com 3 Water Street, Stamford, http://www.anthemion.co.uk Lincs, U.K., PE9 2NJ +44 (0)1780 765976 StoryLines: an intuitive writing tool http://www.storylinescentral.com HelpBlocks: easy HTML help authoring http://www.helpblocks.com ======================================================================== --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon May 12 23:20:50 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 12 May 2003 23:20:50 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19FKj4-00013B-00 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 23:20:50 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.3) with ESMTP id h4CLKjmr027245 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 23:20:45 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4CLKjrG012138 (8.12.9/3.57); Mon, 12 May 2003 23:20:45 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4CLKj0o012137 (8.12.9/1.3); Mon, 12 May 2003 23:20:45 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4CLKirG012125 (8.12.9/3.57); Mon, 12 May 2003 23:20:44 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 27457 invoked by uid 43863); 12 May 2003 21:20:36 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 27446 invoked from network); 12 May 2003 21:20:36 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <001d01c318cc$54e47840$15b30250@bob> From: "William Manley" To: References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030512210714.03e64c58@mail.btinternet.com> Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 22:20:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Subject: Re: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-7.2 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1047 Lines: 24 If you just want a quick look take a look at: o news.htm and front.htm for the news stuff. All the news items are in news.htm and where the news appears in front.htm you will see o screensh.htm where you will notice that all the screenshot pages are contained within one file and are generated by the xsl so only one page needs to be maintained rather than many I would like to take an active role in maintaining the website if you would have me, general maintenance, reorginisation, adding articles, etc. I've used wxWindows and I love it so am trying to give somthing back, but my progrramming skills arn't quite on par with you lot who are all programming beasts so I thaught this would be somthing I could help out with. Sorry for taking up so much of your time, thanks for your input William Manley --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Tue May 13 10:00:23 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Tue, 13 May 2003 10:00:23 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19FUhz-0005vh-00 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 10:00:23 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.3) with ESMTP id h4D80JHT010643 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 10:00:19 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4D80IrG004193 (8.12.9/3.57); Tue, 13 May 2003 10:00:18 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4D80IH4004192 (8.12.9/1.3); Tue, 13 May 2003 10:00:18 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4D80IrG004179 (8.12.9/3.57); Tue, 13 May 2003 10:00:18 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 18468 invoked by uid 43863); 13 May 2003 08:00:11 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 18456 invoked from network); 13 May 2003 08:00:11 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.1.20030513085238.04002030@mail.btinternet.com> X-Sender: julian.smart@mail.btinternet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 09:00:08 +0100 To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org From: Julian Smart In-Reply-To: <001d01c318cc$54e47840$15b30250@bob> References: <5.0.2.1.1.20030512210714.03e64c58@mail.btinternet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: Re: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1845 Lines: 42 Hi William, At 22:20 12/05/2003 +0100, you wrote: >o news.htm and front.htm for the news stuff. All the news items are in >news.htm and where the news appears in front.htm you will see > I do agree, that's much more manageable. >o screensh.htm where you will notice that all the screenshot pages are >contained within one file and are generated by the xsl so only one page >needs to be maintained rather than many Right, though I prefer the original layout of the screenshot index page; I guess this could be reproduced in your system. >I would like to take an active role in maintaining the website if you would >have me, general maintenance, reorginisation, adding articles, etc. I've >used wxWindows and I love it so am trying to give somthing back, but my >progrramming skills arn't quite on par with you lot who are all programming >beasts so I thaught this would be somthing I could help out with. That would be really great, I'd welcome it, if we can get to a state that's on a par with (hopefully better than) the original presentation, and also give the required people the tools to regenerate it. Thanks, Julian ========================================================================= Julian Smart mailto:julian.smart@btopenworld.com 3 Water Street, Stamford, http://www.anthemion.co.uk Lincs, U.K., PE9 2NJ +44 (0)1780 765976 StoryLines: an intuitive writing tool http://www.storylinescentral.com HelpBlocks: easy HTML help authoring http://www.helpblocks.com ======================================================================== --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun May 25 01:12:39 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 25 May 2003 01:12:39 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19JiBr-00019Q-00 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 01:12:39 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4ONCYxY015644 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 01:12:34 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4ONCX0P009902 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 25 May 2003 01:12:34 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4ONCXGv009901 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 25 May 2003 01:12:33 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4ONCX0P009889 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 25 May 2003 01:12:33 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 18800 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 23:12:27 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 18789 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 23:12:27 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 01:11:25 +0200 (Romance Daylight Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <000d01c317fa$dd6b85a0$15b30250@bob> In-Reply-To: <000d01c317fa$dd6b85a0$15b30250@bob> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) Message-Id: Subject: Re: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.7 required=5.5 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1686 Lines: 43 On Sun, 11 May 2003 21:21:10 +0100 William Manley wrote: WM> The major changes are the screenshots, the news and the download pages. The WM> screenshots and the download pages need a bit of polish mind. Sorry for replying so late, but I've just had a look at the new download page and unfortunately I have to say that I don't like it at all. It would make much more sense to me to have some kind of hierarchical organization by default and using the comboboxes just doesn't seem like the right way to do it. I.e. we could have something like: - page 1: choose you platform (with some explanations, too!) - page 2: choose your version (same again) - page 3: choose your mirror, download format, ... We could keep the current page if you wish but it doesn't seem very useful to me and the list of files is more intimidating than anything else, especially without any description nor even file size mention. About the same goes for the screenshots page: I'd prefer a more hierarchical organization except that, of course, we wouldb't have multiple pages here. Instead we could have a grid (well, table): screenshots in rows and platforms in columns, e.g.: Win32 Mac Unix minimal sample in (in)action: * * * where "*"s are either just links or (very) small thumbnails. Sorry for the criticism but the download page change simply doesn't look as the step in the right direction to me. Thanks, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun May 25 01:38:10 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 25 May 2003 01:38:10 +0200 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19JiaX-0001Ck-00 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 01:38:10 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.4) with ESMTP id h4ONc5xY015913 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 01:38:06 +0200 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h4ONYL0P010851 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 25 May 2003 01:34:21 +0200 (MEST) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h4ONYLrR010850 (8.12.9/1.3); Sun, 25 May 2003 01:34:21 +0200 (MEST) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h4ONYK0P010838 (8.12.9/3.58); Sun, 25 May 2003 01:34:20 +0200 (MEST) Received: (qmail 380 invoked by uid 43863); 24 May 2003 23:34:14 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-dev@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 366 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 23:34:14 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Message-ID: <01b501c3224d$02f5df80$15b30250@bob> From: "William Manley" To: References: <000d01c317fa$dd6b85a0$15b30250@bob> Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 00:34:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4925.2800 Subject: Re: [wx-dev] wxWebsite X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.5 required=5.5 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Status: RO Content-Length: 1727 Lines: 40 > WM> The major changes are the screenshots, the news and the download pages. The > WM> screenshots and the download pages need a bit of polish mind. > > Sorry for replying so late, but I've just had a look at the new download > page and unfortunately I have to say that I don't like it at all. It would > make much more sense to me to have some kind of hierarchical organization > by default and using the comboboxes just doesn't seem like the right way to > do it. I agree, after I completed it I looked at it and I thaught hmm, useless, so for now I was just going to include the old download pages until I can think of a better solution. > About the same goes for the screenshots page: I'd prefer a more > hierarchical organization except that, of course, we wouldb't have multiple > pages here. Instead we could have a grid (well, table): screenshots in rows > and platforms in columns, e.g.: > > Win32 Mac Unix > minimal sample in (in)action: * * * > > where "*"s are either just links or (very) small thumbnails. TBH I quite like the screenshot pages as they are, like a journey through wxWindows. The uploaded screenshot pages are not the same as I have here. They are more true to the originals and more complete, but I might have a play with your idea, it would be useful for direct comparisions which could be quite good. > Sorry for the criticism but the download page change simply doesn't look > as the step in the right direction to me. I totally agree. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-dev-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-dev-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 15:37:04 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 15:37:04 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wNdo-0003lV-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 15:37:04 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LEash6032345 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 15:36:55 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LEasFh001921 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 15:36:54 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LEasF7001920 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 15:36:54 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LEarFh001908 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 15:36:53 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 5552 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 14:35:56 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 5545 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 14:35:56 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 09:35:41 -0500 Subject: Re: doc system for 3.0 ? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: David Elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <64457A5A-5BAA-11D7-B0C5-0003938C5A62@stcnet.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.4 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_03_05,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 270 Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 2475 Lines: 55 On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 04:10 AM, William Manley wrote: > David Elliott wrote: >> Well, there is the wxWiki to which anyone can contribute. > > True, but this isn't the *proper* manual, and some people would not > bother > looking in the wiki. > Well, that's their issue. Sadly, it's our problem. :-( There will always be people who refuse to do their own work and instead try to pass it on to others. >> I also suggest if you are interested in helping out with official >> documentation that you take a look at the Tex source code. It's >> actually quite easy to write new documentation or update existing >> documentation. Simply look at how things are done and you should get >> an immediate feel for it. > > You still need to know about CVS and patches and sourceforge. Seeing > as we > are aiming high recently, would it be possible to have some sort of > on-line > documentation editing system (Java applet mabey) where patches are > made and > sent off to sourceforge after edititng? > Wasn't I saying something about this the other day? The real problem is not that Tex is difficult. The real problem is that learning CVS is more than most documentation writers need to handle. Therefore, if you think about it, it doesn't matter what format the documentation is. As long as we require documentation maintainers to have a working knowledge of UNIX, we won't see many documentation maintainers. Now, Java!? Are you NUTS!? That's blasphemy there, son! :-) What's really needed is a wxWindows application that can handle this. There is already a CVS client written in wxWindows. That's the first piece of the puzzle. Then we'd need some sort of wizard or guide that walks documentation maintainers through the process of using CVS. I don't know if sourceforge would take too kindly to the program automatically submitting to sourceforge. Nor am I entirely sure it is necessary. A better solution would be to simply open the users web browser to the wxWindows patch site on sourceforge, and give them clear instructions as to how they should submit the form (simply write a description, set the appropriate categories, and attach the generated patch file). Now, does anybody have the time to write such a beast? -Dave --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 16:32:53 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:32:53 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wOVp-0003y3-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:32:53 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LFWgh6002222 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:32:43 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LFPDFh020186 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:25:13 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LFPC63020179 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:25:12 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LFPCFh020165 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:25:12 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 25941 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 15:24:18 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 25934 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 15:24:17 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:01:21 +0100 From: Arnout Engelen To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) Message-ID: <20030321150121.GD3204@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> References: <64457A5A-5BAA-11D7-B0C5-0003938C5A62@stcnet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <64457A5A-5BAA-11D7-B0C5-0003938C5A62@stcnet.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Face: +5<4p=wAw9CfJeb1)}#72dL9Kz#0|wnyTLORn(~.;+B3?(:8HXkA^9yzF/aHD/p~Ge]GlYyLtI3+U<""hFLN3JH}}n= X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.1 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, SPAM_PHRASE_02_03,USER_AGENT,USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 271 Status: RO Content-Length: 2182 Lines: 51 On Fri, Mar 21, 2003 at 09:35:41AM -0500, David Elliott wrote: > On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 04:10 AM, William Manley wrote: > > >David Elliott wrote: > >>Well, there is the wxWiki to which anyone can contribute. > > > >True, but this isn't the *proper* manual, and some people would not > >bother looking in the wiki. > > > >>I also suggest if you are interested in helping out with official > >>documentation that you take a look at the Tex source code. It's > >>actually quite easy to write new documentation or update existing > >>documentation. Simply look at how things are done and you should get > >>an immediate feel for it. > > > >You still need to know about CVS and patches and sourceforge. Seeing > >as we > >are aiming high recently, would it be possible to have some sort of > >on-line > >documentation editing system (Java applet mabey) where patches are > >made and > >sent off to sourceforge after edititng? > > Wasn't I saying something about this the other day? The real problem > is not that Tex is difficult. The real problem is that learning CVS is > more than most documentation writers need to handle. Therefore, if you > think about it, it doesn't matter what format the documentation is. As > long as we require documentation maintainers to have a working > knowledge of UNIX, we won't see many documentation maintainers. some web-based system would be nice, but require an awful lot of coding that could be used better for improving wxwindows itself. For the time being, it might be easiest if people who don't want to bother with cvs and stuff add to wiki.wxwindows.org, the notes there can be merged into the official documentation later. Are we still planning to, would the transition this prove feasible, to move to Doxygen for the official docs? Past threads seem to tend to look upon this favourably, I made a recap: http://wiki.wxwindows.org/wiki.pl?Using_Doxygen_For_The_WxWindows_Documentation Kind Regards, Arnout --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 16:44:39 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:44:39 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wOhD-000405-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:44:39 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LFiTh6002858 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:44:30 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LFiTFh026619 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:44:29 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LFiTFl026611 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:44:29 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LFiSFh026581 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:44:28 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 5106 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 15:43:37 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 5099 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 15:43:37 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 10:43:16 -0500 Subject: Re: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: David Elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030321150121.GD3204@mintzer.sci.kun.nl> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.7 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_02_03,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 272 Status: RO Content-Length: 3044 Lines: 65 On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 10:01 AM, Arnout Engelen wrote: > On Fri, Mar 21, 2003 at 09:35:41AM -0500, David Elliott wrote: >> >> Wasn't I saying something about this the other day? The real problem >> is not that Tex is difficult. The real problem is that learning CVS >> is >> more than most documentation writers need to handle. Therefore, if >> you >> think about it, it doesn't matter what format the documentation is. >> As >> long as we require documentation maintainers to have a working >> knowledge of UNIX, we won't see many documentation maintainers. > > some web-based system would be nice, but require an awful lot of coding > that could be used better for improving wxwindows itself. For the time > being, it might be easiest if people who don't want to bother with cvs > and stuff add to wiki.wxwindows.org, the notes there can be merged into > the official documentation later. > Well, a few additions to something like TortoiseCVS would probably do the trick with a lot less work. CVS is really not that difficult either, it's just that many people aren't familiar with it so it's a barrier to entry. If checking documentation out of CVS and then creating patches against CVS can be made easier, then the barrier to entry will be lowered to an acceptable level. Anyone who can't use use a plain old text editor has no business writing wxWindows documentation anyway, but there are plenty of people who certainly would do this if they didn't have to play with CVS. > > Are we still planning to, would the transition this prove feasible, to > move to Doxygen for the official docs? Past threads seem to tend to > look > upon this favourably, I made a recap: > > http://wiki.wxwindows.org/ > wiki.pl?Using_Doxygen_For_The_WxWindows_Documentation > I am personally very much against this. I think moving to Doxygen is trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist whilst creating more problems. If documentation moves to Doxygen it becomes increasingly difficult for a non-developer to modify it. To me that seems like a major step backwards. The only advantage to Doxygen is that it supposedly makes it easier to write documentation, though I fail to see how polluting the source code with documentation is any easier than simply writing it into the appropriate tex file. ":e docs/latex/wx/THECLASS.tex" is not that difficult. Let's be honest here. If documentation is integrated into the source, it still doesn't make a difference. Most developers still won't bother to write it. Unless the developer makes an effort to write a little blurb about the method then even Doxygen can only come up with some basic text indicating that the function exists. What good is that? If you wanted to see all available functions, you'd look in the headers. -Dave --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 17:33:20 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 17:33:20 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wPSK-0004AX-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 17:33:20 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LGX9h6003998 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 17:33:10 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LGX9Fh008762 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 17:33:09 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LGX9Ds008761 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 17:33:09 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LGX8Fh008748 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 17:33:09 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 27546 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 16:32:07 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 27535 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 16:32:06 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Re: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) From: Robert.Roebling@t-online.de (Robert Roebling) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 17:31:43 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <1048264106.3e7b3daaeb506@webmail.t-online.de> In-Reply-To: References: X-Approved: 55bea4d474708a86J_ZCK6YSNwdRsLlzXLSOmRCK1MD6sasD X-Mailer: T-Online WebMail 2.05 X-Complaints-To: abuse#webmail@t-online.com X-Sender: 320015312021-0001@t-dialin.net X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.4 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01, USER_AGENT_TONLINE version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 273 Status: RO Content-Length: 770 Lines: 21 David Elliott wrote: > Let's be honest here. If documentation is integrated > into the source, it still doesn't make a difference. This is totally wrong. Developers look at the source anyway and what takes time to go a different file (rather find it or create it) and type the function parameters one by one. This is an order of magnitude more tedious than adding a comment to a header or its implementation. Often, there *are* comments already which just needed to be formalized a little. Robert -- Robert Roebling, MD --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 21:23:23 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:23:23 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wT2x-0004ph-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:23:23 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LKNDh6008165 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:23:14 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LKNDFh019235 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:23:13 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LKNDRi019234 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:23:13 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LKNCFh019221 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:23:13 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 14472 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 20:22:28 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 14465 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 20:22:27 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:22:23 +0100 (Romance Standard Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[2]: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <1048264106.3e7b3daaeb506@webmail.t-online.de> In-Reply-To: <1048264106.3e7b3daaeb506@webmail.t-online.de> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.6 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01 version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 275 Status: RO Content-Length: 2485 Lines: 52 On Fri, 21 Mar 2003 17:31:43 +0100 (CET) Robert Roebling wrote: RR> David Elliott wrote: RR> RR> > Let's be honest here. If documentation is integrated RR> > into the source, it still doesn't make a difference. RR> RR> This is totally wrong. Developers look at the source RR> anyway and what takes time to go a different file RR> (rather find it or create it) and type the function RR> parameters one by one. Come on, nobody does it like this. I have editor macros which do it faster in a different file than you can do it in the same one :-) For the purposes of writing the new documentation I agree with David that only the willingness to do it counts. If you care about the docs, you write them, wherever they have to be. If you don't, you don't do it anywhere. Where I agree with you is that having the comments in the sources makes it much more likely that they're going to be _updated_ (as opposed to created) when something changes. This is the only -- but quite big -- advantage of doxygen. OTOH it is also directly related to its almost only -- but very big IMHO -- disadvantage which is that the sources become much less readable at a glance. Another disadvantage is that doxygen docs are in a quite unflexible format, you always have the same sections &c. I don't know how to integrate our topic overviews and other "non reference" parts of the docs with it. RR> This is an order of magnitude RR> more tedious than adding a comment to a header or its RR> implementation. Often, there *are* comments already RR> which just needed to be formalized a little. Do you know that makegen does exactly this? It extracts all functions from the file and puts the comments preceding them as the docs. It even has a diff mode in which it compares the methods documented in .tex file with the ones really present in the .h one (including checking for parameter mismatch). And it was a product of 2 or 3 days of work -- I'm sure we can do much better if we have some time to spend on this. The trouble is that nobody is using it anyhow so why bother improving the tool... Still I think any time spent on improving the docs would be better spent on doing this rather than on "backporting" the docs from .tex to doxygen format. Regards, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 21:47:17 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:47:17 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wTQ5-0004to-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:47:17 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LKl7h6008703 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:47:07 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LKl7Fh022516 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:47:07 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LKl7xO022514 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:47:07 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LKl6Fh022502 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:47:06 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 28021 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 20:45:58 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 28009 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 20:45:58 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Subject: Re: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) From: Andy Cedilnik To: WXUser In-Reply-To: References: <1048264106.3e7b3daaeb506@webmail.t-online.de> Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Kitware Inc. Message-Id: <1048279550.5355.218.camel@xanth> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.2 Date: 21 Mar 2003 15:45:50 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.3 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,NOSPAM_INC,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_03_05 version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 276 Status: RO Content-Length: 2895 Lines: 58 Hi Vadim, Please do not take this e-mail wrong... As a developer on couple large projects (such as VTK and CMake), which use Doxygen, I can tell you that that is not true. VTK for example has 800+ classes, which are all perfectly readable and we also 40+ developers, which none of them complains about readability. I would go even as far as to say that wxWindows sources are less readable that most VTK sources. Here is example: http://public.kitware.com/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/VTK/Rendering/vtkRenderer.h?rev=1.113&content-type=text/x-cvsweb-markup&cvsroot=VTK Compare this to let say: http://cvs.wxwindows.org/viewcvs.cgi/wxWindows/include/wx/dynarray.h?rev=1.51&content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup On Fri, 2003-03-21 at 15:22, Vadim Zeitlin wrote: > Where I agree with you is that having the comments in the sources makes it > much more likely that they're going to be _updated_ (as opposed to created) > when something changes. This is the only -- but quite big -- advantage of > doxygen. OTOH it is also directly related to its almost only -- but very > big IMHO -- disadvantage which is that the sources become much less > readable at a glance. Another disadvantage is that doxygen docs are in a > quite unflexible format, you always have the same sections &c. I don't know > how to integrate our topic overviews and other "non reference" parts of the > docs with it. > Do you know that makegen does exactly this? It extracts all functions from > the file and puts the comments preceding them as the docs. It even has a > diff mode in which it compares the methods documented in .tex file with the > ones really present in the .h one (including checking for parameter > mismatch). And it was a product of 2 or 3 days of work -- I'm sure we can > do much better if we have some time to spend on this. > The trouble is that nobody is using it anyhow so why bother improving the > tool... Still I think any time spent on improving the docs would be better > spent on doing this rather than on "backporting" the docs from .tex to > doxygen format. Interesting choice of words there. I think time spend in quality documentation is always good spend. So, I started writing scripts that would do the "backporting" easy, but got swamped here. In any case, it is much easier to do that then using your simple 25 step way of getting Tex documentation to work. Oh, and did I mention that you need a whole bunch of tools installed? I guess since all those tools are already on all unixes except HP-UX, where the preinstalled crash and you need to get them from GNU ftp. Anyway, doxygen has its flaws, but readability of source code and ease of maintenance are not one of them. Andy --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 21:59:34 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:59:34 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wTby-0004vw-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:59:34 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LKxPh6008914 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:59:25 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LKxOFh024638 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:59:25 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LKxOfF024637 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:59:24 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LKxOFh024624 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:59:24 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 5166 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 20:58:29 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 5155 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 20:58:29 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:58:24 +0100 (Romance Standard Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[2]: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) To: WXUser Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <1048264106.3e7b3daaeb506@webmail.t-online.de> <1048279550.5355.218.camel@xanth> In-Reply-To: <1048279550.5355.218.camel@xanth> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.2 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_05_08 version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 278 Status: RO Content-Length: 4118 Lines: 80 On 21 Mar 2003 15:45:50 -0500 Andy Cedilnik wrote: AC> As a developer on couple large projects (such as VTK and CMake), which AC> use Doxygen, I can tell you that that is not true. VTK for example has AC> 800+ classes, which are all perfectly readable and we also 40+ AC> developers, which none of them complains about readability. I would go AC> even as far as to say that wxWindows sources are less readable that most AC> VTK sources. I don't say that wxWindows are always very readable (although I think most headers are). I do say that if you just want to have a look at some class doxygen comments keep getting into your way. In particular, you just can't see as much useful things on screen because of them. Of course, this assumes that doxygen-less code still has comments so that you can understand what's going on without using the docs -- this is not always true in practice but this is something I personally always try to do. AC> Compare this to let say: AC> AC> http://cvs.wxwindows.org/viewcvs.cgi/wxWindows/include/wx/dynarray.h?rev=1.51&content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup Ugh, dynarray.h is really not an honest choice. It's a hack implementing a kludge which is only necessary because of lack of template support in the old compilers (which were not old at all at the time of its writing). I don't think doxygen helps you to make 50 line long macros more readable, does it? AC> > The trouble is that nobody is using it anyhow so why bother improving the AC> > tool... Still I think any time spent on improving the docs would be better AC> > spent on doing this rather than on "backporting" the docs from .tex to AC> > doxygen format. AC> AC> Interesting choice of words there. I think time spend in quality AC> documentation is always good spend. So, I started writing scripts that AC> would do the "backporting" easy, but got swamped here. In any case, it AC> is much easier to do that then using your simple 25 step way of getting AC> Tex documentation to work. Err, you got swamped (which I take to mean that you couldn't do it easily) but it's still easier than following a sequence of maybe several but simple steps? I don't quite follow you here... AC> Oh, and did I mention that you need a whole AC> bunch of tools installed? I guess since all those tools are already on AC> all unixes except HP-UX, where the preinstalled crash and you need to AC> get them from GNU ftp. Oh, come on, I'm not your personal enemy just because I think that we need something else than cmake for wxWindows. What does this have to do with the broken HP-UX make, please tell me? As for TeX, it surely does work on more platforms than doxygen and I dare say has a slightly bigger installed base. The only other tool you need is helpgen which is written in wxWindows and included in its distribution so it doesn't seem to be a big stretch of imagination to say that you just might already have it... And, just to be complete, I don't know of any core (here meaning susceptible to right docs) wxWin developers working under HP-UX. AC> Anyway, doxygen has its flaws, but readability of source code and ease AC> of maintenance are not one of them. Please read again what I wrote. In particular, I said that ease of maintenance is the biggest doxygen *advantage*. I do think that the code is less readable with doxygen markup in it and I believe that a truely smart tools would be able to pick up information from the normal comments without any special markup at all (no, helpgen is not such tool by far -- but that's the idea). In any case, as each time this discussion restarts I can only repeat that my personal position is that unless someone comes for a way (be it an automatic -- but working! -- script or employing an army of 10000 slaves^H^H^H^H^H^HH1B workers) to convert the existing docs to doxygen there is really not much to speak about. Regards, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 22:21:45 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:21:45 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wTxR-00052J-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:21:45 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LLLah6009415 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:21:36 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LLLaFh027533 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:21:36 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LLLaur027532 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:21:36 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LLLZFh027520 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:21:35 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 17872 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 21:20:31 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 17865 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 21:20:31 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Subject: Re: Re[2]: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) From: Andy Cedilnik To: WXUser In-Reply-To: References: <1048264106.3e7b3daaeb506@webmail.t-online.de> <1048279550.5355.218.camel@xanth> Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Kitware Inc. Message-Id: <1048281626.14844.234.camel@xanth> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.2 Date: 21 Mar 2003 16:20:27 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.8 required=6.0 tests=DISCLAIMER,DOMAIN_BODY,IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST, NOSPAM_INC,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_02_03 version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 281 Status: RO X-Status: A Content-Length: 5358 Lines: 151 Hi Vadim, On Fri, 2003-03-21 at 15:58, Vadim Zeitlin wrote: > Ugh, dynarray.h is really not an honest choice. It's a hack implementing > a kludge which is only necessary because of lack of template support in the > old compilers (which were not old at all at the time of its writing). I > don't think doxygen helps you to make 50 line long macros more readable, > does it? Well, I guess a formal documentation rules do not hurt. For example, In VTK there is very little doxygen tags: /*========================================================================= .. file info .. copyright and disclaimer =========================================================================*/ // .NAME whatever_class - quick comment // .SECTION Description // long comment // .SECTION See Also // other files #ifndef __filename_h #define __filename_h #include "superclass.h" class VTK_FILTERING_EXPORT whatever_class : public superclass { public: // Description // Method description void Method (); ... }; #endif So, how much tags are here? .NAME, .SECTION Desctiption and .SECTION See Also. And that is only on top of the class. Then every method has // Description in front of description. I think (my personal opinion and probably opinion of several other VTK developers) that adds enough overhead to be readable and you are still able to see enough of file. You can always split view, which is what most editors support. > Err, you got swamped (which I take to mean that you couldn't do it easily) > but it's still easier than following a sequence of maybe several but simple > steps? I don't quite follow you here... Well, I do have house to pay. The script is easy and is mostly done, but there are couple of cases where handwriting needs to be done. This is mostly because the Tex files are not consistent. Also, after finishing wxWindows interface to CMake, I stopped playing with wxWindows. > Oh, come on, I'm not your personal enemy just because I think that we need > something else than cmake for wxWindows. What does this have to do with the > broken HP-UX make, please tell me? As for TeX, it surely does work on more > platforms than doxygen and I dare say has a slightly bigger installed base. > The only other tool you need is helpgen which is written in wxWindows and > included in its distribution so it doesn't seem to be a big stretch of > imagination to say that you just might already have it... And, just to be > complete, I don't know of any core (here meaning susceptible to right docs) > wxWin developers working under HP-UX. I do not think you are my personal enemy. Far from that. Though, your opinion is sometimes different than mine. > Please read again what I wrote. In particular, I said that ease of > maintenance is the biggest doxygen *advantage*. I do think that the code is > less readable with doxygen markup in it and I believe that a truely smart > tools would be able to pick up information from the normal comments without > any special markup at all (no, helpgen is not such tool by far -- but > that's the idea). I looked a bit more through wx header files and found this: // ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- // wxButton: a push button // ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- class WXDLLEXPORT wxButtonBase : public wxControl { public: // show the image in the button in addition to the label virtual void SetImageLabel(const wxBitmap& WXUNUSED(bitmap)) { } // set the margins around the image virtual void SetImageMargins(wxCoord WXUNUSED(x), wxCoord WXUNUSED(y)) { } // this wxButton method is called when the button becomes the default one // on its panel virtual void SetDefault() { } // returns the default button size for this platform static wxSize GetDefaultSize(); }; Here is the same thing with doxygen tags: // ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- // wxButton: a push button // ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- class WXDLLEXPORT wxButtonBase : public wxControl { public: ///! show the image in the button in addition to the label virtual void SetImageLabel(const wxBitmap& WXUNUSED(bitmap)) { } ///! set the margins around the image virtual void SetImageMargins(wxCoord WXUNUSED(x), wxCoord WXUNUSED(y)) { } ///! this wxButton method is called when the button becomes the default one ///! on its panel virtual void SetDefault() { } ///! returns the default button size for this platform static wxSize GetDefaultSize(); }; I can see how these tags can be distracting. > In any case, as each time this discussion restarts I can only repeat that > my personal position is that unless someone comes for a way (be it an > automatic -- but working! -- script or employing an army of 10000 > slaves^H^H^H^H^H^HH1B workers) to convert the existing docs to doxygen > there is really not much to speak about. Ok. If you come to Albany (NY) area, let me know and I will invite you to a drink and we can discuss this in details. Andy --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 22:36:45 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:36:45 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wUBx-000557-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:36:45 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LLaZh6009675 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:36:36 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LLWpFh029346 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:32:51 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LLWoOJ029345 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:32:50 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LLWnFh029306 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:32:50 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 23801 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 21:31:20 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 23790 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 21:31:19 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:31:15 +0100 (Romance Standard Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[4]: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) To: WXUser Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <1048264106.3e7b3daaeb506@webmail.t-online.de><1048279550.5355.218.camel@xanth> <1048281626.14844.234.camel@xanth> In-Reply-To: <1048281626.14844.234.camel@xanth> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.2 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_05_08 version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 282 Status: RO Content-Length: 3949 Lines: 94 On 21 Mar 2003 16:20:27 -0500 Andy Cedilnik wrote: AC> > Err, you got swamped (which I take to mean that you couldn't do it easily) AC> > but it's still easier than following a sequence of maybe several but simple AC> > steps? I don't quite follow you here... AC> AC> Well, I do have house to pay. I understand this and I think that doing this would require a lot of time and this is why nobody is going to do it. AC> The script is easy and is mostly done, but AC> there are couple of cases where handwriting needs to be done. We all know about the last 10% taking 90% of the time, don't we? AC> > Oh, come on, I'm not your personal enemy just because I think that we need AC> > something else than cmake for wxWindows. What does this have to do with the AC> > broken HP-UX make, please tell me? As for TeX, it surely does work on more AC> > platforms than doxygen and I dare say has a slightly bigger installed base. AC> > The only other tool you need is helpgen which is written in wxWindows and AC> > included in its distribution so it doesn't seem to be a big stretch of AC> > imagination to say that you just might already have it... And, just to be AC> > complete, I don't know of any core (here meaning susceptible to right docs) AC> > wxWin developers working under HP-UX. AC> AC> I do not think you are my personal enemy. Far from that. Though, your AC> opinion is sometimes different than mine. I have a distinct impression that you're just trying to prove me wrong in this discussion. It's impossible because I only give my _personal_ opinion (which can't be wrong as long as it's mine :-) and even if it were possible I don't see what would it change. Let me repeat again: if someone comes with a way to completely replace the existing manual with doxygen and does the job, I will consider switching to it. Before this happens I just don't see the point. AC> Here is the same thing with doxygen tags: What you show is half-doxygenized code. It doesn't add _any_ useful information, helpgen could do exactly the same -- exactly because there is no markup. We surely need more information in the docs! AC> class WXDLLEXPORT wxButtonBase : public wxControl AC> { AC> public: AC> ///! show the image in the button in addition to the label AC> virtual void SetImageLabel(const wxBitmap& WXUNUSED(bitmap)) { } AC> AC> ///! set the margins around the image AC> virtual void SetImageMargins(wxCoord WXUNUSED(x), wxCoord AC> WXUNUSED(y)) { } Here is what I write in my code when I do use doxygen (and, as a matter of fact, I do use it a lot): /** Set the margins around the image shown on the bitmap. If the button has an image, the margin around it is configurable in some ports. The default should be fine but can be changed with this method. @param x the horizontal margin @param y the vertical margin */ virtual void SetImageMargins(wxCoord x, wxCoord y); (I use "autobrief" option). This is what I'd call acceptable documentation (it should be probably more detailed than this, in fact). The comment in your version is not much more useful than simply mentuioning the functions existence. BTW, notice that there is another problem here: in fact, this entire class should not be documented at all (or maybe it should but as wxButton and then wxButton shouldn't). I don't think there is any simple way to make doxygen aware about this. AC> I can see how these tags can be distracting. They surely are not if you don't use them :-) AC> If you come to Albany (NY) area, let me know and I will invite you to a AC> drink and we can discuss this in details. Ok, thanks, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 23:11:32 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:11:32 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wUjc-0005Am-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:11:32 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LMBMh6010187 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:11:22 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LM3qFh003635 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:03:52 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LM3q26003634 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:03:52 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LM3pFh003621 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:03:51 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 7023 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 22:03:09 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 7012 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 22:03:09 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) From: "Lukasz Michalski" To: Subject: RE: Re[4]: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:06:13 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.9 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_OUTLOOK version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 284 Status: RO Content-Length: 630 Lines: 30 > > BTW, notice that there is another problem here: in fact, this > entire class > should not be documented at all (or maybe it should but as wxButton and > then wxButton shouldn't). I don't think there is any simple way to make > doxygen aware about this. > #ifndef DOC_DONT_EXTRACT #endif and add: PREDEFINED = DOC_DONT_EXTRACT PREPROCESSING = YES in the config. Yes, this is ugly. Regards, Lukasz --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 23:16:14 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:16:14 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wUoA-0005BP-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:16:14 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LMG4h6010266 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:16:05 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LMG4Fh004998 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:16:04 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LMG4i2004997 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:16:04 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LMG3Fh004985 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:16:03 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 12155 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 22:15:27 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 12148 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 22:15:27 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:15:22 +0100 (Romance Standard Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[6]: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.6 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01 version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 285 Status: RO Content-Length: 1213 Lines: 36 On Fri, 21 Mar 2003 23:06:13 +0100 Lukasz Michalski wrote: LM> > BTW, notice that there is another problem here: in fact, this entire LM> > class should not be documented at all (or maybe it should but as LM> > wxButton and then wxButton shouldn't). I don't think there is any LM> > simple way to make doxygen aware about this. LM> LM> #ifndef DOC_DONT_EXTRACT LM> LM> LM> LM> #endif Thanks, I didn't think about this possibility -- but it would indeed work. LM> Yes, this is ugly. Indeed. But, continuing our thought experiment, it would indeed be better to document just the methods of wxButtonBase and not of wxButton because: 1. like this you're sure that only the public API methods are documented, as it should be 2. you only have to document one class (wxButtonBase), not N of them (all wxButtons for different ports) But this would require documenting wxButtonBase as if it were a wxButton. I don't think doxygen can do this... Regards, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Mar 22 11:55:51 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 11:55:51 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wgfH-0008Ki-00 for ; Sat, 22 Mar 2003 11:55:51 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2MAtfna025273 for ; Sat, 22 Mar 2003 11:55:41 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2MAmBFh024231 (8.12.8/3.57); Sat, 22 Mar 2003 11:48:11 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2MAmBdX024230 (8.12.8/1.3); Sat, 22 Mar 2003 11:48:11 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2MAmAFh024215 (8.12.8/3.57); Sat, 22 Mar 2003 11:48:10 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 27342 invoked by uid 43863); 22 Mar 2003 10:47:24 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 27329 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2003 10:47:23 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) From: "Lukasz Michalski" To: Subject: RE: Re[6]: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 11:50:16 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.1 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01, USER_AGENT_OUTLOOK version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 293 Status: RO Content-Length: 810 Lines: 31 > > LM> Yes, this is ugly. > > Indeed. But, continuing our thought experiment, it would indeed be better > to document just the methods of wxButtonBase and not of wxButton because: > > 1. like this you're sure that only the public API methods are documented, > as it should be > 2. you only have to document one class (wxButtonBase), not N of them (all > wxButtons for different ports) > > But this would require documenting wxButtonBase as if it were a wxButton. > I don't think doxygen can do this... > This is very simple: /** @class wxButton */ class wxButtonBase { [..] }; Regards, Lukasz --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Mar 22 09:34:54 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 09:34:54 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18weSs-00080u-00 for ; Sat, 22 Mar 2003 09:34:54 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2M8Yjna023582 for ; Sat, 22 Mar 2003 09:34:45 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2M8YjFh008089 (8.12.8/3.57); Sat, 22 Mar 2003 09:34:45 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2M8YiHQ008088 (8.12.8/1.3); Sat, 22 Mar 2003 09:34:44 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2M8YiFh008076 (8.12.8/3.57); Sat, 22 Mar 2003 09:34:44 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 4507 invoked by uid 43863); 22 Mar 2003 08:34:19 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 4496 invoked by uid 509); 22 Mar 2003 08:34:18 -0000 MBOX-Line: From news@sunsite.dk Sat Mar 22 08:34:18 2003 Delivered-To: news-comp.soft-sys.wxwindows-news2mail@sunsite.dk Path: sunsite.dk!news.net.uni-c.dk!uninett.no!feed.news.nacamar.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!dclient80-218-106-75.hispeed.CH!not-for-mail From: otto.wyss@bluewin.ch (Otto Wyss) Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.wxwindows Subject: Re: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 09:30:09 +0100 Message-ID: <1fs7tok.dxsqke6byypkN%otto.wyss@bluewin.ch> References: <1048264106.3e7b3daaeb506@webmail.t-online.de> <1048279550.5355.218.camel@xanth> <1048281626.14844.234.camel@xanth> NNTP-Posting-Host: dclient80-218-106-75.hispeed.ch (80.218.106.75) X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1048321810 75177064 80.218.106.75 (16 [23565]) X-Orig-Path: otto.wyss User-Agent: MacSOUP/D-2.4.6 Xref: sunsite.dk comp.soft-sys.wxwindows:21424 X-Delivered-By: NewsDeliver 1.2 X-NNTP-Email-Gateway: NewsDeliver 1.2 - staff@sunsite.dk To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.3 required=6.0 tests=KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 292 Status: RO Content-Length: 1073 Lines: 19 Vadim Zeitlin wrote: > Let me repeat again: if someone comes with a way to completely replace the > existing manual with doxygen and does the job, I will consider switching to > it. Before this happens I just don't see the point. > IMO this is a rather high fetched goal. How about aiming for a solution where doxygen could be merged with the current docs? This way the transition could be done over a longer period or even not done completely. There are always some overviews or technotes which can't be integrated easily into the code. So doxygen is used for code documenting and tex (or whatever) for the rest and both are merged together. Whatever is chosen for documentation, there has to be a single point where a user starts looking at. Any reference to external docs have to be mark as such in the starting doc. O. Wyss --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 21:48:51 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:48:51 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wTRb-0004uE-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:48:51 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LKmfh6008738 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:48:42 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LKmfFh022752 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:48:41 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LKmfKW022749 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:48:41 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LKmeFh022736 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 21:48:41 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 28808 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 20:46:48 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 28797 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 20:46:48 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 15:46:35 -0500 Subject: Re: Re[2]: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: David Elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <34722A56-5BDE-11D7-B0C5-0003938C5A62@stcnet.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.7 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 277 Status: RO Content-Length: 4231 Lines: 107 Robert, I held off replying on this one while I collected my thoughts about it. Instead I'm replying here. On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 03:22 PM, Vadim Zeitlin wrote: > On Fri, 21 Mar 2003 17:31:43 +0100 (CET) Robert Roebling > wrote: > > RR> David Elliott wrote: > RR> > RR> > Let's be honest here. If documentation is integrated > RR> > into the source, it still doesn't make a difference. > RR> > RR> This is totally wrong. Developers look at the source > RR> anyway and what takes time to go a different file > RR> (rather find it or create it) and type the function > RR> parameters one by one. > > Come on, nobody does it like this. I have editor macros which do it > faster > in a different file than you can do it in the same one :-) For the > purposes > of writing the new documentation I agree with David that only the > willingness to do it counts. If you care about the docs, you write > them, > wherever they have to be. If you don't, you don't do it anywhere. > Yes, I was going to say I could do it with even some basic regex or something. And as I said, it is of course the willingness to do it that makes the difference. > Where I agree with you is that having the comments in the sources > makes it > much more likely that they're going to be _updated_ (as opposed to > created) > when something changes. This is the only -- but quite big -- advantage > of > doxygen. OTOH it is also directly related to its almost only -- but > very > big IMHO -- disadvantage which is that the sources become much less > readable at a glance. Another disadvantage is that doxygen docs are in > a > quite unflexible format, you always have the same sections &c. I don't > know > how to integrate our topic overviews and other "non reference" parts > of the > docs with it. > Yes, the costs of using Doxygen far outweigh the few benefits it can provide. > RR> This is an order of magnitude > RR> more tedious than adding a comment to a header or its > RR> implementation. Often, there *are* comments already > RR> which just needed to be formalized a little. > > Do you know that makegen does exactly this? It extracts all functions > from > the file and puts the comments preceding them as the docs. It even has > a > diff mode in which it compares the methods documented in .tex file > with the > ones really present in the .h one (including checking for parameter > mismatch). And it was a product of 2 or 3 days of work -- I'm sure we > can > do much better if we have some time to spend on this. > :-) In the reply I was about to send to Robert I was going to suggest that we make a simple tool that would generate stub documentation from the header files and maybe later we could make a tool that kept the documentation in sync. But, as I see, someone else had the same idea already so now I'm REALLY left wondering why there is this big push to change to Doxygen when (especially considering this) it offers very few benefits. > The trouble is that nobody is using it anyhow so why bother improving > the > tool... Still I think any time spent on improving the docs would be > better > spent on doing this rather than on "backporting" the docs from .tex to > doxygen format. > As I said a few weeks ago, we need more meta-documentation. I wasn't even aware that makegen existed. My guess is that most people think that our documentation system is tedious because they are unaware of the proper tools. I think if all the time spent theorizing about how great Doxygen could be was put into creating tools and documentation for the existing documentation system then the existing documentation would be better already. Sadly, it seems to stagnate while we're all busy wondering if we should go to Doxygen or maybe use StarOffice instead or any number of ideas that have been proposed. Perhaps the problem is that no one has accurately defined the requirements of the documentation system. What features do we and don't we need? -Dave --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 22:04:13 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:04:13 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wTgT-0004yU-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:04:13 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LL44h6009082 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:04:04 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LL44Fh025482 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:04:04 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LL44k9025481 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:04:04 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LL43Fh025468 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:04:03 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 7463 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 21:03:02 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 7456 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 21:03:02 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:02:58 +0100 (Romance Standard Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re[4]: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <34722A56-5BDE-11D7-B0C5-0003938C5A62@stcnet.com> In-Reply-To: <34722A56-5BDE-11D7-B0C5-0003938C5A62@stcnet.com> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.6 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01 version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 279 Status: RO Content-Length: 1984 Lines: 45 On Fri, 21 Mar 2003 15:46:35 -0500 David Elliott wrote: DE> Yes, the costs of using Doxygen far outweigh the few benefits it can DE> provide. I am unsure about the "far" part but I think they do outweigh. DE> In the reply I was about to send to Robert I was going to suggest that DE> we make a simple tool that would generate stub documentation from the DE> header files and maybe later we could make a tool that kept the DE> documentation in sync. DE> DE> But, as I see, someone else had the same idea already so now I'm REALLY DE> left wondering why there is this big push to change to Doxygen when DE> (especially considering this) it offers very few benefits. This tool (helpgen, it's in utils) doesn't work well. To be precise, it is buggy because it uses a buggy C++ parser. And to make matters worse the parser was written by Alexandras (author of FL and other things as well) which means that although it's very good for the time it took him to wrote it (2 days I think which is very impressive) it can't be understood nor modified/fixed by anybody else except him. DE> As I said a few weeks ago, we need more meta-documentation. I wasn't DE> even aware that makegen existed. Sorry, I made a typo -- it should have been "helpgen". DE> Perhaps the problem is that no one has accurately defined the DE> requirements of the documentation system. What features do we and DE> don't we need? It was done a few times. Basicly we need support for many different output formats (HTML and PDF at least, WinHelp and PS are nice too although the former becomes less and less important) and the ability to include images and use simple markup. That's about all I can think of. Note that doxygen does satisfy both requirments. Regards, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Fri Mar 21 22:48:09 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:48:09 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18wUMz-000568-00 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:48:09 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2LLlxh6009812 for ; Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:48:00 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2LLlwFh001622 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:47:58 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2LLlvxP001619 (8.12.8/1.3); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:47:57 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2LLluFh001602 (8.12.8/3.57); Fri, 21 Mar 2003 22:47:56 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 773 invoked by uid 43863); 21 Mar 2003 21:47:12 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 765 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2003 21:47:12 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:46:57 -0500 Subject: Re: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: David Elliott To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.7 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_00_01,USER_AGENT_APPLEMAIL version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 283 Status: RO Content-Length: 2740 Lines: 66 On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 04:02 PM, Vadim Zeitlin wrote: > On Fri, 21 Mar 2003 15:46:35 -0500 David Elliott > wrote: > > DE> Yes, the costs of using Doxygen far outweigh the few benefits it > can > DE> provide. > > I am unsure about the "far" part but I think they do outweigh. > Okay. Granted that the headers don't look all that messy with Doxygen tags embedded. However, I much prefer lean headers that just list the function names one per line with the occasional comment here and there. Doxygen goes completely against this style and requires at least about 4 lines for every declared method. To me, that is unacceptable! > This tool (helpgen, it's in utils) doesn't work well. To be precise, > it is > buggy because it uses a buggy C++ parser. And to make matters worse the > parser was written by Alexandras (author of FL and other things as > well) > which means that although it's very good for the time it took him to > wrote > it (2 days I think which is very impressive) it can't be understood nor > modified/fixed by anybody else except him. > But it's a proof of concept. It proves that it's not that hard to write a tool that generates documentation from header files. Switching to Doxygen would be like using a sledgehammer when only a small mallet is required. > DE> Perhaps the problem is that no one has accurately defined the > DE> requirements of the documentation system. What features do we and > DE> don't we need? > > It was done a few times. Basicly we need support for many different > output > formats (HTML and PDF at least, WinHelp and PS are nice too although > the > former becomes less and less important) and the ability to include > images > and use simple markup. That's about all I can think of. Note that > doxygen > does satisfy both requirments. > Sorry, I should have been more clear. Those weren't the requirements I had in mind. Those requirements are a given. I'm talking about requirements for documentation authors. What requirements do people actually WILLING to work on documentation have? For instance. Is it required that the documentation and declaration be together in the headers, or would a tool that kept the documentation and headers synchronized be sufficient? Would streamlining the authoring process encourage more people to write documentation? Stuff like that. The way I see it is that we need to help the willing, not introduce a new system when nobody is willing to write documentation anyway. -Dave --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sat Mar 22 12:44:24 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 12:44:24 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18whQG-0008SD-00 for ; Sat, 22 Mar 2003 12:44:24 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2MBiEna025839 for ; Sat, 22 Mar 2003 12:44:14 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2MBaiFh029872 (8.12.8/3.57); Sat, 22 Mar 2003 12:36:44 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2MBai8Q029871 (8.12.8/1.3); Sat, 22 Mar 2003 12:36:44 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2MBahFh029858 (8.12.8/3.57); Sat, 22 Mar 2003 12:36:44 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 16898 invoked by uid 43863); 22 Mar 2003 11:35:52 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 16888 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2003 11:35:52 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) From: "Lukasz Michalski" To: Subject: RE: doc system for 3.0? (Doxygen?) Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 12:39:00 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.6 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, SPAM_PHRASE_03_05,USER_AGENT_OUTLOOK version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 294 Status: RO Content-Length: 2243 Lines: 48 > > For instance. Is it required that the documentation and declaration be > together in the headers, or would a tool that kept the documentation > and headers synchronized be sufficient? Would streamlining the > authoring process encourage more people to write documentation? > > Stuff like that. The way I see it is that we need to help the willing, > not introduce a new system when nobody is willing to write > documentation anyway. > >From my point of view, I think that you must have tool that: - let write detailed descriptions or sections like "topic overwiews" with images etc in simple, _well known format_. People that could write it could not know much about wxWindows internals, they are just library users. - make developers to write descriptions of classes, methods and other parts of code in one format with syntax checking. Now IMHO the major problem is not in CVS, but in Tex. This is not "well known format" and users don't want to learn yet another format. You can get big feedback from users, but you will end up integrating plain text or html formatted pieces into tex documentation. If you can automate this process then maybe it is good solution. BTW, you forgot about another advantage of doxygen - most users know this tool well. If there is possibility to configure CVS to let users do "controlled commits" (commits that must be reviewed by developers) I think you will get big feedback just because users are looking at the source code from time to time and could write some docs about things that are not clear at first look. I don't think that current documentation must be rewritten - but it will be great if doxygen tags could be added to current comments in sources. It is much easier to search functions like wxStat() in doxygen generated files that in sources. It is also very big advantage for users who wants to write a patch - they don't have entire structure of wxWindows in head or on diagrams and must analyze tons of files just to discover what is inherited from what. Regards, Lukasz --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Sun Mar 23 21:26:52 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Sun, 23 Mar 2003 21:26:52 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18xC3Q-00063m-00 for ; Sun, 23 Mar 2003 21:26:52 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2NKQmMC025912 for ; Sun, 23 Mar 2003 21:26:48 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2NKJIFh006253 (8.12.8/3.57); Sun, 23 Mar 2003 21:19:18 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2NKJIQo006252 (8.12.8/1.3); Sun, 23 Mar 2003 21:19:18 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2NKJHFh006239 (8.12.8/3.57); Sun, 23 Mar 2003 21:19:17 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 2702 invoked by uid 43863); 23 Mar 2003 20:18:41 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 2695 invoked from network); 23 Mar 2003 20:18:41 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2003 15:14:33 -0500 From: Brian Victor To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Subject: Editor Macros Message-ID: <20030323201433.GA19452@bhv1.adelphia.net> Mail-Followup-To: Brian Victor , wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org References: <1048264106.3e7b3daaeb506@webmail.t-online.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.25i X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.3 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01, USER_AGENT,USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 295 Status: RO Content-Length: 913 Lines: 23 Not resurrecting the debate. Really. On Fri, Mar 21, 2003 at 09:22:23PM +0100, Vadim Zeitlin wrote: >On Fri, 21 Mar 2003 17:31:43 +0100 (CET) Robert Roebling wrote: >RR> This is totally wrong. Developers look at the source >RR> anyway and what takes time to go a different file >RR> (rather find it or create it) and type the function >RR> parameters one by one. > Come on, nobody does it like this. I have editor macros which do it faster >in a different file than you can do it in the same one :-) Would you mind sharing these? There have been some minor things I could have improved in the documentation if I didn't need to break my work flow to do so. Thanks, -- Brian --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org From arnouten@sci.kun.nl Mon Mar 24 00:45:10 2003 Return-path: Envelope-to: arnouten@bzzt.net Delivery-date: Mon, 24 Mar 2003 00:45:10 +0100 Received: from vhe-530008.sshn.net ([195.169.222.38] helo=elektron.atoom.net) by mail.bzzt.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18xF9K-0006eM-00 for ; Mon, 24 Mar 2003 00:45:10 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl (wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1]) by elektron.atoom.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h2NNj6MC029234 for ; Mon, 24 Mar 2003 00:45:06 +0100 Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by wn1.sci.kun.nl via wn1.sci.kun.nl [131.174.8.1] with ESMTP for id h2NNj5Fh002624 (8.12.8/3.57); Mon, 24 Mar 2003 00:45:05 +0100 (MET) Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl via arnouten@localhost for arnouten@bzzt.net id h2NNj5RW002623 (8.12.8/1.3); Mon, 24 Mar 2003 00:45:05 +0100 (MET) Received: from sunsite.dk by wn1.sci.kun.nl via sunsite.dk [130.225.247.90] with SMTP for id h2NNj5Fh002611 (8.12.8/3.57); Mon, 24 Mar 2003 00:45:05 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 29200 invoked by uid 43863); 23 Mar 2003 23:44:36 -0000 Mailing-List: contact wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Reply-To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Delivered-To: mailing list wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Received: (qmail 29193 invoked from network); 23 Mar 2003 23:44:36 -0000 X-MessageWall-Score: 0 (sunsite.dk) Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2003 00:44:30 +0100 (Romance Standard Time) From: Vadim Zeitlin Subject: Re: Editor Macros To: wx-users@lists.wxwindows.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: INLINE References: <1048264106.3e7b3daaeb506@webmail.t-online.de> <20030323201433.GA19452@bhv1.adelphia.net> In-Reply-To: <20030323201433.GA19452@bhv1.adelphia.net> X-Mailer: Mahogany 0.65.0 'Claire', running under Windows NT 5.0 (build 2195, Service Pack 3) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.6 required=6.0 tests=IN_REP_TO,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_00_01 version=2.43 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) X-Keywords: X-UID: 296 Status: RO Content-Length: 3857 Lines: 122 On Sun, 23 Mar 2003 15:14:33 -0500 Brian Victor wrote: BV> On Fri, Mar 21, 2003 at 09:22:23PM +0100, Vadim Zeitlin wrote: BV> >On Fri, 21 Mar 2003 17:31:43 +0100 (CET) Robert Roebling wrote: BV> >RR> This is totally wrong. Developers look at the source BV> >RR> anyway and what takes time to go a different file BV> >RR> (rather find it or create it) and type the function BV> >RR> parameters one by one. BV> > Come on, nobody does it like this. I have editor macros which do it faster BV> >in a different file than you can do it in the same one :-) BV> BV> Would you mind sharing these? Not at all, but they're vor vim -- if you don't use it, they would be quite useless for you. Anyhow, they're so small that I'll just paste them here and hope they'd be useful to someone: ----- cut here ------ " this file contains macros for writing wxWindows documentation " last modified on 17/08/98 " some characters must be escaped in TeX inoremap _ \_ inoremap & \& " ~ should be replaced with this imap ~ \destruct{ " verbatim environment map ,verb o\begin{verbatim}\end{verbatim}O " itemized environment map ,item i\begin{itemize}\itemsep=0pt\end{itemize}O imap \item{}i " write Topic and press Ctrl-H => \helpref{Topic}{topic} " registers used: " t the name of the class - to insert before label " h contents deleted " " NB: notice lowercase sonversion! imap B"hyei\helpref{lEa}{th}bguwwa " coverts a one line C++ comment into \membersection statement nmap ,sec :s-^ *// *--^i\membersection{A} " turn a word into italic/typewriter font nmap wbi{\tt wea} nmap wbi{\it wea} " helpers of MakeFunc() start here """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" " prepend (without changing the line itself) a \membersection entry func! MakeMembSect() let cname = @t let cnamelower = substitute(cname, ".*", "\\L&", "") exe "s/^.*\\W\\(\\w\\+\\)(.*$/% " . cname . "::\\1" . nr2char(13) . "\\\\membersection{" . cname . "::\\1}{" . cnamelower . "\\L\\1}" . nr2char(13) . nr2char(13) . "\\E&" endfunc " turn the func decl into \func entry func! MakeFunc() exe "s/^\\([^(]\\+\\W\\)\\(\\w\\+\\)(/\\\\func{\\1}{\\2}(/" exe "s/^\\\\func{\\(.\\+\\) }{\\(\\w\\+\\)}/\\\\func{\\1}{\\2}/" endf " convert function parameter list into \param func! MakeParam() exe "s/\\([(,]\\s*\\)\\([^,)=]\\+[ *]\\)\\([^=^,][^,)]\\+\\)/\\1\\\\param{\\2}{\\3}/" exe "s/(/{/" exe "s/);$/}/" endf " to be used instead of MakeParam() for void functions func! MakeVoid() exe "s/();/{\\\\void}/" endf " transforms a function declaration into a func entry func! DeclToFunc() call MakeMembSect() call MakeFunc() if match(getline("."), " const;") != -1 exe "s/ const;/;/" exe "s/^./&const/" endif if match(getline("."), "()") != -1 call MakeVoid() else call MakeParam() endif endf nmap :call DeclToFunc() ----- cut here ------ This file is a bit of a mess, and not all of the macros are useful. In fact, I mostly use only 2 of them: 1. DeclToFunc() (which is bound to Ctrl-F): just copy a function from the .h file, position the cursor at its line and press it to turn it into a new function documentation block. 2. Ctrl-H in Insert mode which you can use after typing "Foo" to turn it into "\helpref{Foo}{wxclassfoo}" For both of those to work, the register "t should contain the name of the class. Please feel free to ask more questions and/or propose modifications. Regards, VZ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: wx-users-unsubscribe@lists.wxwindows.org For additional commands, e-mail: wx-users-help@lists.wxwindows.org